Milt,

I wouldn't automaticly dissmiss this dog as a protection candidate. Much of this is dependant on experience. The dog needs to be tested to get a good evaluation. With a dog with a little weaker nerves can still be trained to do credible work by going slower in training and making sure the dog has adequate ecperience prior to moving to the next step. I have seen this done with dogs before, it just takes longer and needs to done carefully. It probably wouldn't make a PS candidate, but could turn out to be more dog than most people need.

Richard I think I'm dismissing Abdull more then the dog. Look at his history up to this point in raising a puppy. You know more then anyone know how many man hours you put into dog training and research and the expanse can't be ignored for proper trainers. BTW when did you get the BRT,what do have now 4 dogs?

Milt

I now recall Abdul's earlier post. I responded to that post by defending him. I will somewhat do the same now.

From reading all of these posts, I get the impression that Abdul is not in any way intentionally trying to ruin the dog. I think the man has found a good forum to ask his questions. Now maybe his expectations for this dog are un-realistic. Thats why I asked what he had in mind for the dog. I tend to agree with Richard that we can't automatically assume that this dog is not made of the right stuff. I agree with others that have said that there have been some mistakes made with the dog. I also think that 5 months old is young for the dog to be "territorial" in the way that Abdul described him. The dog does seem to have some questionable nerves. I know I am going around in circles here. My point was then and it is now that sometimes we hammer newcomers. I say, thankfully the man is asking questions and just maybe he can get the right advice to get the dog back on track. One reason I respect Richard Cannon and Vince so much is because even though they know tons more than the average person, they always treat newcomers well and never talk down to them or are dismissive of them. We can all learn a lot from this. Sorry I veered off topic....Vince you can issue me 2 demerits!!LOL <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/laugh.gif" alt="" />

Milt:

Not everyone has your enthusiasm and attention for detail. If they did life would be easier. But that is not reality.

Abdul-Karim has his heart in the right place but might be biting off a little more than he can chew. I recommend for anyone new to this type of training to research a little before and be prepared for your puppy or dog before he arrives. Videos, books, visiting clubs and other people who have experience in this type of training is invaluable. But unfortunately this is not always the case and you find yourself with a mouthy pup around kids who has to be kenneled more than is healthy and a possible nerve problem that your not experienced enough to deal with. But this is all in the past and now it is up to us to help him make the best of this situation. First I would buy Ed’s tape on puppy bitework. Watch it and then ask a few specific questions that relate to your unique situation. Good luck.

Thanks Alot Ed, you know what I mean. I could not wait to reply, first I would like to know what a typical day for one of Milts dogs is. For those that have been quite helpful, my pup was never exposed to stairs, even at his breeder. The kennel as well as the shop were on the ground floor. He is now negoiting the stairs with no problems, as well as the wooden deck. As far as the crating issue from a different post, he is no longer crated at all unless it is bed time, thanks to positive help from some members on this board. The territorial issue, My yard is fenced in and he runs up to the fence when the children are returning from school and barks, in regards to the garbage man, he came inside the yard the pup barked at his ankles, in regards to being dissapointed that he did not take the bite - from one of eds videos it said that a puppy does not have the proper drive at his age to take a bite, anyone with common sense would not want the lawsuit from your dog biting a person you have allowed in your yard. I took my pup back to the breeder Oscar Rojas (Most people in NJ & NY know of his work as helper and trainer) last week and the puppy took his first bite off the puppy sleeve with a full mouth and countered when he did not have a full mouth, Rojas suggested schutzhund and I know from experience he does not mess with dogs that he does not think has it. I have personally dropped pans, pop gun, vacum cleaner, these things do not effect him at all, also there is a bit of snow here and when the plow comes thru he lifts and drops the plow right in front of my house this did not effect the dog in any way he lifted his head saw the problem ran to the gate and watched him. He also has no problems on the ice, chases jolly ball, slides in ice gains footing and continues to chase ball. I also have eds tape, building drive and focus, I noticed that none of the dogs are my dogs age, can I start him in this manner? His prey drive is strong but not as strong as some in the video, I thought I should just work on the building drive part. I have and will continue to learn a lot from this board about what and what not to do in regards to raising my pup. He is strong willed and becoming quite a family member.

now you have the perfect dog.

milt

Be careful about relying on the breeder for all your advice. Get a second opinion. The dogs on Ed's tape were purposely chosen to have all different levels of drive. I would at least expect my dog to be in the top half of the dog's shown. Otherwise this type of work will be difficult.

He is definetly in the top half, should I let him play with toys when I am at work. I was told to only let him play when we are working but I have been leaving toys in his area when I am at work, otherwise he goes into his blanket and rips the stuffing out of it. Do I abandon the basic ob tape that I received from ed and just work the bernard flinks tape to get the ob thru that. I have only been letting him get 1 or two bites per session, should I base this on how hard he is trying to get the prey?

Ed's tapes are stil valid. Bernard works on drive building and grip. Ed goes into the 3 steps of OB. Apples and oranges. And yes drive toy are for work only.

Thanks all for the information, the information received from this thread has been valuable. I don't know how long it stays open, but I am sure I will start another one with some more crazy questions as my boy grows into this titled sch III, PPD PSD animal . <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/laugh.gif" alt="" />