P.S. Here's the thing, from my POV: If I am the pack leader, then the way I want the "pack" to live is the way it has to be. And I want no aggression and no fights.

I think a clear line needs to be drawn between "stop" and "prevent". A human in charge of dogs needs to always have the power to STOP a fight...but it is, IMO, dangerously naiive to say that you can 100% PREVENT any and all fights.

Most people think I'm nuts for keeping my males separate, and don't really believe me that they'd just as soon kill each other as look at each other. I prefer to keep all of them, separate, than bury any of them.

Most people also tell me after their dogs get in a horrendous fight that "they always got along just fine." There is always a different dynamic present w/the human present than there is when the human is not present; this is basic animal behavior. This change in dynamic will affect different animals differently, and therefore defies generalization. My whole angle is why chance it?

We're on the road so I am trying to find time to check the board as I can. Ed and I DO have 4 house dogs. They all can be loose in the house together BUT NEVER unsupervised. All of these dogs are at different stages of our pack structure program, due to their different ages and temperaments. It doesn't really have anything to do with who is a competition dog and who isn't. Pack structure and leadership isn't something you do when your dogs are bad or your dogs are new. It's a lifetime project in some form or another.

The 10 year old Corgi is loose in the house 24/7, no matter what other dogs are running around. She doesn't care one way or the other about other dogs, and is respected by all. We support this but will correct her if she doesn't follow the rules of the house.

4 1/2 year old Malinois is loose almost all the time, she gets along well with the Corgi and is my shadow. She sleeps next the my bed, lays at my feet all day while I work. She is highly territorial and is a dog that will bite if someone comes inside the house so she's been controlled a LOT over her life. She is sent to her bed whenever someone comes to the door (which is a frequent occurence at our place)

Ed's dog sticks with him when he's in the house.

Rush is now 16 months old and will actually lay down and sleep in the same room while I work with the other dogs in the same room. There are times he still has to be tethered. I choose tethering over constantly nagging him to stay out of everyone's space.

My dogs all go for 1 or 2 group walks/snowshoe hikes daily for an hour each time, loose but wearing ecollars. I don't tolerate dominant behavior, or allow my dogs to possess items when we are on these walks. I know from experience if Rush starts running at Raine and body slamming her, he's going to instigate a fight. I know that if any of my dog's have a stick or toy while we are out running it's likely to trigger some possessiveness or injury as they run at break neck speed with a branch sticking out of their mouths. All I have to say is NOPE when someone starts pushing the boundaries and that usually settles it. I do allow my dogs to play with each other and run and be dogs.

As animal owners or parents, think about how well 2 kids or 2 horses or 2 dogs get along. THEN add a third one to the mix, that's when you will see a whole new dynamic appear. The more dogs you have in the mix, the more of a pack leader you MUST be. This is the reason that Steve and some of the others mention that owners of 3 dogs sometimes have more issues than single or 2 dog owners.

FWIW, I have had similar experiences with 4. I have even wondered if 4 is more like 2 & 2 b/c it seems more successful for some reason. 3 can be a killer. 5 and 6 aren't great, either, although I really don't even bother with that b/c of the danger of "what if?" and I'm always by myself. I do have a foursome I let out together in the mornings w/no issues (2 males, 2 females, and they pair up that way). Morning is kind of "free for all" time for mine; I let them be goofballs before I head to work.

Dynamics are fascinating, IMO. IME, it takes a while to learn each individual dog well enough to guess who will be ok w/whom with minimal interference/work. Ages come into play as well, as do hormones. Certainly, if you're actively working them, they should all be able to be loose together, but just for "dog time" is a bit risky, IMO. The longer I have the same dogs the easier it gets, but I often have different/transient dogs and that absolutely does change things, I've noticed.

Mod delete duplicate posting

Edited by Connie Sutherland (02/16/2009 01:35 PM)
Edit reason: duplicate & hijack

 Quote: connie sutherland

P.S. Here's the thing, from my POV: If I am the pack leader, then the way I want the "pack" to live is the way it has to be. And I want no aggression and no fights.

I have the same POV. I'm the leader of a pack of 4 dogs, 2 males, 2 females, all under the age of 4. Each was added to the family one year apart. All but the youngest are neutered (which I think helps).

They don't fight because I don't allow it. I enforce a "zero tolerance" policy for any signs of aggression or resource guarding.

I realize this is easier with some dogs/breeds than others--and mine were selected primarily based on how I thought they'd integrate into the existing pack structure. I also think it helps tremendously to tire them out with some kind of activity to burn that energy in a non-aggressive way.

I had a pack when it was me, my hubby and our GSD. Then the pack expanded.

I have 3 dogs right now and 2 of them are female (one is 3 yr old and the other 8 months old) and they are more likely to try to fight. But I do not allow it. It is my way or the highway. I can have all 3 out together, all three inside together without incident. Some days they need to be seperated between wither inside or outside or one in a crate. We would like to eventually get another Lab. Don't know if it'll be male or female, but I do know that it will know who the leader is, ME.

I am the "alpha dog" in my house. My hubby, tries to assert his authority when he's home. I even have to correct him when he's trying to get the dog to do something (sit, down, off, go-go away-etc.)