Quote: connie sutherland

"Yes, one evening he just started throwing up, about 4 times and was not feeling well, and shivering. So we took him right in. There has been no blood in vomit or stool, no loose stools."




How long has been free of symptoms? (Or is he completely symptom-free now?)

Did the late-night snacks end the other issue (of bile vomiting in the early morning)?



eta
How are the folate injections going? Are you able to do them OK?

Sharon, can we get an update? What symptoms does he still have, and how are the injections going?

Cody's injections are going well, of course he has had only one. I have ordered the b12, waiting for it to arrive this week to give him his injection.

Right now with meds no symptoms, but by sunday meds will be gone and we will see if he has really improved.

Since giving him 3 meals a day- one later in the evening his tummy is not gurgling. So, we will know more after the meds are discontinued.

He seems ok, we are just puzzled at this episode.
sharon

Sorry, Sharon. Just trying to catch up.

So the only problem with his stomach, when the problem is occurring, is stomach noises and morning bile vomits?

Yes. After the initial injection from the vet to stop vomiting, and the fluids given, he no longer vomited unless it was in the morning before breakfast and it was bile looking. Not the huge volume that he vomited before. So, I took him to the vet and they gave him meds and he has been on them since then. So, I guess we will not know until the meds stop- which is this weekend..then we will see if his problem returns.
The big problem I am having with the vets is they do not like raw diets. Since Cody had the parasite they say it comes from raw meat and as long as I feed the raw meat he will continue to have parasites. They do say though that the parasite usually does not affect dogs but just passes through them. But they think he needs to be on a special diet, which consists of processed diet.
In my heart I do not believe in processed foods as I believe it is stripped of most of its nutrients. I would rather my dogs have live healthy food. So the battle begins.

thanks for responding Mike.

If it is only bile vomits, and they start back, I would either try to feed earlier in the morning, OR a bigger meal at night, OR a small snack before bedtime.

"Since Cody had the parasite they say it comes from raw meat and as long as I feed the raw meat he will continue to have parasites. They do say though that the parasite usually does not affect dogs but just passes through them. But they think he needs to be on a special diet, which consists of processed diet."

THE classic symptom is diarrhea. I think we talked about diarrhea at length here and that Cody had none, right? I looked up coccidiosis in two vet manuals and many authoritative vet sites, and diarrhea diarrhea diarrhea is listed over and over as the presenting symptom.

A good review: http://www.peteducation.com/article.cfm?c=2+1622&aid=727

Here's another overview (it isn't Beagle-specific): http://www.beaglesunlimited.com/health/coccidiosis-diagnosis-treatment-and-prevention


JMO!

As far as raw diet goes, if coccidiosis is deleted from the list, then what exactly is the vet saying is the problem with raw? It's very hard to argue with (or even understand) "they do not like raw diets."

Pencil in hand, I would ask exactly what the raw diet problem was in their eyes. I wouldn't stop asking until I had a reply I understood and agreed with or until I concluded that there was no reason except for unfounded personal aversion.

JMO!

Also, if I did receive a response that I knew was valid, such as pathogen overload having triggered gastritis or colitis, I still would think about a careful home-cooked diet way before I would buy waiting-room crap-in-a-bag.

JMO!

But again, from what we have read here, unless there's something I missed, you are not seeing the symptoms of either gastritis or coccidiosis (both of which present with diarrhea). All you have seen is an episode of full-meal vomiting (not really unusual in dogs, who tend to vomit when they have eaten too much or when they have eaten something that didn't agree with them, and early-morning bile vomiting (which again is not at all uncommon and relatively simple to fix).

This is JMO, and I'm not a health professional.

"So, I guess we will not know until the meds stop- which is this weekend..then we will see if his problem returns."

Yup. I don't remember what the meds are; is he getting an anti-vomiting med?

Am I missing anything (for symptoms)? One full-meal vomiting event and many early-morning bile pukes that ended with late-night snacks? And the dog is his normal "wild man" self, no inappetence and no lethargy?

I keep thinking there's a piece missing.


eta
You have the same skepticism I would have in your place, Sharon.




Edited by Connie Sutherland (03/16/2011 05:17 PM)
Edit reason: eta

The early morning bile spit-up is really very manageable with a bedtime snack. My poodle started the same thing a month or two ago (spitting up a small amount of yellow-green clear fluid at 5:00 am several days in a row). So I started saving out about a third of his dinner (which he normally eats at about 6:00 p.m.) and he now gets that mouthful right before bedtime at 10:30 or so. This simple change in routine cured the bile vomit after the first snack; he hasn't vomited since.

Some dogs' stomachs have a time clock that goes off if it is empty too long. Stomach acid builds up in anticipation of food, and if the food doesn't show up soon enough, the acid comes up.

Only one of my four dogs has this problem. It's just an individual quirk with some dogs. My vet wasn't the least concerned. She agreed with my approach. Much easier and better than trying to give a med to suppress stomach acid or change the dogs diet.

 Quote: tracy collins

.... Some dogs' stomachs have a time clock that goes off if it is empty too long. Stomach acid builds up in anticipation of food, and if the food doesn't show up soon enough, the acid comes up.

Only one of my four dogs has this problem. It's just an individual quirk with some dogs. My vet wasn't the least concerned. She agreed with my approach. Much easier and better than trying to give a med to suppress stomach acid or change the dogs diet.

Right now, I have just one who does this (also easily fixed, and now they all get a bedtime snack held from supper because I hated to give one "extra" just before bed while the others watched with tragic faces). But I have had several over the years -- particularly small dogs, although I don't know why this would be skewed toward small dogs.

We've seen it on this board dozens of times, with all size dogs.

I think this latest "parasite" in Cody's fecal is a red herring. Even the vet said it wasn't parasitic to the dog--it passed right through without causing symptoms.

If Cody is asymptomatic now, why does the vet think any change is necessary?

 Quote: tracy collins

I think this latest "parasite" in Cody's fecal is a red herring. Even the vet said it wasn't parasitic to the dog--it passed right through without causing symptoms.

If Cody is asymptomatic now, why does the vet think any change is necessary?

Yup, my question exactly ("I keep thinking there's a piece missing") only you were more succinct!