Re: Trending topic: Fake therapy dogs
[Re: Duane Hull ]
#381658 - 08/09/2013 02:59 PM |
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Definitions in the US - Therapy dog = dog trained for animal assisted therapy, i.e. reading to dog in schools, hospital visits, nursing home visits and the like. They have no federal public access rights but are often permitted to go into public and private facilities when they volunteer/work (usually not allowed into food service businesses due to health codes). Service dog = dog that is trained to serve a person with a disability. They have public access rights as long as they are not disruptive. Public access rights = if the public is allowed, the dog is allowed to accompany it's owner and do it's job.
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Re: Trending topic: Fake therapy dogs
[Re: Duane Hull ]
#381687 - 08/11/2013 06:05 AM |
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Big difference between a therapy dog and a service dog as Mara has posted.
I would like to see some sort of certification for SERVICE dogs but I'm afraid that any certification would bar some legitimate service dogs or make the process such a hassle that people would go without a dog that could benefit from one.
Tanner was owner trained with very little formal obedience. As a service dog for a mental disability it's hard to just come up with a list of tasks that he performed. He made a big difference in the woman's ability to function in public until harassment made her start keeping him and consequently herself home again. Any certification process would probably bar him from working due to a lack of formal obedience training, lack of demonstrable skills, lack of training from a recognized organization or "certified" trainer, etc.
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Re: Trending topic: Fake therapy dogs
[Re: Duane Hull ]
#381690 - 08/11/2013 11:35 AM |
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You wouldn't need a list of tasks to perform to be certified. If you need a service dog, you are under the care and instruction of professional, so all you would need is a letter stating the need for the service. It need not be any more complicated than getting a handicapped permit for your car.
Therapy dogs are more of a grey area than service dogs. A service dog is trained to perform specific functions, which may or may not include obedience training.
Having proper ID visible for the public should reduce any harassment that the patient feels he/she is receiving.
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Re: Trending topic: Fake therapy dogs
[Re: Duane Hull ]
#381691 - 08/11/2013 12:39 PM |
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Actually I'd argue that service dogs are more of a gray area. There are several national/regional organizations that certify theray dogs. Dogs must be of a certain temperment and have a certain level of training. Service dog have none of that. It is not unreasonable for a service dog to have a certain level of obedience training. All dogs coming from a reputable service dog organization do. And it is currently within the legal right of a business to ask what tasks a dog perform for an individual. That said, I'm really not sure about federal licensing for service dogs. I think it would prevent some problems but cause others.
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Re: Trending topic: Fake therapy dogs
[Re: Duane Hull ]
#381692 - 08/11/2013 12:53 PM |
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I too have mixed feelings about a federal registry. I feel like the current law already addresses the fake service dog issue as they can be kicked out of a public place for misbehavior.
For mental disabilities, yes there are tasks that can be trained but its not always needed. Many dogs instinctively will help the owner and don't need training to help with things such as anxiety, panic attacks, depression, aggression. I think as long as the dog helps the disabled owner function and its clean and well behaved, then its a service dog.
I think the part where it says they must have trained tasks is because originally the first service dogs allowed were for people with physical disabilities. For a mental disorder, just the emotional support of the dog being there with them can help a person go in public who otherwise wouldn't be able to.
On the other hand, for example...great trained tasks for depression or anxiety is to teach the dog to put its upper body on your lap, stand between you and people, use a tug to disperse anxiety attacks, lick you, pull you to guide you...stuff like that.
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Re: Trending topic: Fake therapy dogs
[Re: Duane Hull ]
#381697 - 08/11/2013 03:54 PM |
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I can certainly see your points, but then how else would you resolve the conflict presented in the article?
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Re: Trending topic: Fake therapy dogs
[Re: Duane Hull ]
#381701 - 08/11/2013 06:46 PM |
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Personally, any well behaved clean dog could be anywhere and it wouldn't bother me....
BUT, not all people feel that way so business owners need to be educated the difference between a therapy dog and a service dog for one thing.
As far as people getting fake service dog patches just to take their dog with them....how about if we register the disabled person, all needed is a doctor's note or description of the disability (personal assumption of a disability is allowed by ADA), they get an official ID tag which doesn't disclose the disability or humiliate them in any way...just like a drivers lic and could be checked at the door if there's any suspicion. Just a thought.
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Re: Trending topic: Fake therapy dogs
[Re: Duane Hull ]
#381707 - 08/11/2013 10:30 PM |
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You wouldn't need a list of tasks to perform to be certified. If you need a service dog, you are under the care and instruction of professional, so all you would need is a letter stating the need for the service. It need not be any more complicated than getting a handicapped permit for your car.
I like that idea. Seems like it would be fairly simple to implement.
I have to wonder if any sort of ID would actually do anything. Most of the existing problems seem to be a lack of understanding of the ADA rather than an ID problem. People are afraid to toss out a misbehaving "service dog" even though the law clearly gives them the right to.
I like these ID's and the company seems to at least make some effort to warn people not to use them to take pets everywhere. Maybe they could make a similar but "official" version.
http://www.servicedogtag.com/
Not a fan of the "emotional support" dog designation. Either it's a service dog or not.
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Re: Trending topic: Fake therapy dogs
[Re: Cathy Goessman ]
#381717 - 08/12/2013 10:21 AM |
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Not a fan of the "emotional support" dog designation. Either it's a service dog or not.
The only thing that does for the person is require places that wouldn't ordinarily rent to you allow you to have a pet. Some people, that's all they need....its for people who are lonely, like widowed old people, or people facing terminal illnesses and are scared depressed but aren't disabled.
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Re: Trending topic: Fake therapy dogs
[Re: Cathy Goessman ]
#381725 - 08/12/2013 01:10 PM |
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People are afraid to toss out a misbehaving "service dog" even though the law clearly gives them the right to.
Only under very limited circumstances.
There's no rule by the ADA that says the dog has to have any identification on it while in public. The owner doesn't have to prove the dog has been trained. It's not illegal to ask what the dog does for the owner but nothing has to be proven so the owner can say anything they want. You cannot ask what disability the owner has.
SDA club will provide you with a patch, ID card and vest if you pay the nominal fee of something like 400 bucks to join. No proof of training is required by the club before they give you all the goodies. They collect your money and send you maybe 10 dollars worth of stuff. And still, the "SD" dog owner is not required to use those trinkets provided by the club.
It's bad enough that people take advantage and abuse the SD program but what's worse is that people try to set businesses up for a lawsuit by bringing in a fake SD with no ID (can't prove it's fake, and ID not required so the deck is stacked against the business)...then they try to see what business will eject them from the premises.
Different areas that people abuse the SD moniker??? Free airline flights...taking FiFi to the restaraunt, movies or wherever....and trying to get around the prohibited breed list for various types of insurance policies. One doesn't have to be a SD owner in need either. One can claim that they "Train" service dogs and get the same benefits. And once again...no official proof is needed. Incredible.
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