Jeff, I'm not seeing that someone would be desperate enough to walk up to me under most circumstances when I have my dog - most people give you a wide berth when you have a large dog on leash, even if it's under good control. If you have a dog that radiates Malice as his usual behavior, hey, it's like an industrial sized can of idiot-be-gone.

And I have a news flash here for you, because I'm thinking you're not too experienced with killing folks - it's stressful. To prepare yourself to kill or injury someone puts you in a fight-or-flight behavior. Even experienced criminals go through this behavior, it's so hard-wiried for humans that basically it takes a serious psychiatrist illness to not show stress at that moment. You may look calm on the outside ( most people won't, even experienced killers ) but your body is dumping adrenaline, your heart is racing, you're sweating - do you think your dog doesn't notice this? Of course it does! And your dog going on alert gives you time to react.

Last point - getting shot does not necessarily take you out of the fight. In two different occasions, I've been wounded and still managed to kill armed opponents that opened fire and hit me before I could return fire. I'm still here, they're not.
Sorry, kinda morbid there..... <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/blush.gif" alt="" />

Will,
I can't see how anyone would be desperate enough to walk up to you under ANY circumstances, with or without dog! You would dwarf your attacker! <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

Yes, predators (human or canine) search for easy prey. Would you rather attack Will or the little old lady with a cane coming from the bank?

As a woman, I feel MUCH safer with my dogs, even if they are not protection trained. They are my eyes and ears, and they give me a confidence I would not feel walking the streets alone, which by itself makes me less of a target. I can post them downstairs in the summer and sleep with the windows open if I want; no one will ever sneak into my house without me knowing. It will give me time to call the police, get my weapon, and get out. I have no desire to find out if I would lose in a hand to hand combat with a serious male attacker, or play the 'my survival drive is greater than your survival drive' game. my dogs are my sentry dogs, a warning system that I am not an easy target, and they have proved themselves more than once to be good at it.


Unless your attacker is experienced with dogs, and knows how to read the difference between defensive drive, fight drive territorial aggression fear aggression, etc, big dogs are a deterrent. Barking dogs might bite, and a defense bite hurts, as does a 'combat mode' bite hurts. Most attackers will not take the chance.

Jeff, Okay I will admit it.I guess I am pretty dumb.lol..just kidding!!! Just to "share"..I am always in defense mode...and I mean always.If a person calmly approached me figuring that I would be an easy target (with or without my dog) to ask directions.He would get a big suprise as I am not dumb.If I couldn't maintain "my space"..having already mapped "my flight pattern" in my head..I would have to fight...disable and or kill..in order to survive to live.Thats the bottom line there. I realize I have alot to learn in ref to my 5 shepherds and that I will do.On the flip side of that "album"..lol There is alot of what "I do Know"..in recognizing genetic traits; working with them and building upon them and strengthening them with each of my dogs...as individuals. Now if I could figure out a way that water could become solid..so the dog could bite and hold..lol I could retire with $$$$ and my poor knees would be saved.lol But also I would have to figure a way that this solid water would have to be won at times.Having said that..I am just in tears..lol..NO RETIREMENT for me!!! lol I still can't figure why my RT loves mudholes lol

All kidding aside for the moment..Does the teeth of a dog..other than the "Obvious"... have any other qualities?

Will, I was in the marine corps for eight years I spent roughly thirteen years in college trying to figure out why i didn't have those problems. I am not a small person, but I have lived in bad neighborhoods and not really had a problem. If you have a really strong dog yes he might bite, but how many are that strong????? I have watched a lot of people misread dogs in the years that I have been doing this. I started in 1978 and have watched dogs that poeple trained for fun, do the real job more often than the ones that should in the real life scenario. It's not like I picked up a leash yesterday. And in all these years that I have been training 99.9999999999% of the people that had problems did not have thier dog with them to begin with. It would be great to know what your dog would do but how many times would that happen in a lifetime. I knew a maniac who would pay bums to attack him in underpasses and I never saw some of his dogs again. Ouch! as a side note I am glad that you are still here and they are gone.

Please direct me to the criminal who's such a fool that they'd accost someone in the company of a large breed dog. I need a good laugh! In 20 years of walking my pet-quality GSDs in the urban cesspool, I've yet to meet one. Even those who hide in the alleys, or lurk outside ATMs have been wary to test my guys' mettle...they're criminals, not idiots. Not to mention that the last thing I'd want is a 'muzzle order' put on my pet...then what's the point?

There is another point in this I haven't seen raised.

If you have a dog that will "naturally protect" for real you have another problem. What you think is a reason for the dog to bite and what the DOG thinks is a reason to bite are going to be vastly different. In some cases they will react in some breed specific ways.

If you have a dog that will protect you had better get proper training on it and you had really better learn to READ the dog so you can tell what it is going to do. The more protective and "real" the dog is the more important it is to do proper training designed to put you in control of aggression. Not all dogs are going to provide a warning in terms of barking before they make their move. I have seen several dogs that will not bark or growl prior to moving in because they want to be able to bite and they have learned that if they make noise the object of their affection will run away.

We have had a problem with this in the breed I have with a couple of dogs being put down over bites and several unintended bites do to bad training and poor control over the situation. When people have come to me about it, I didn't have much problem seeing where the issue came from.

If a breeder tells you that their dogs/breed is naturally protective, ask them what they do to control that. If they say nothing or just basic obedience they are full of crap or looking for a problem. If a dog is naturally protective it will protect whether you want them to or not. That means you had better teach them what you want them to protect you from and you had better teach the dog an out command or someone is going to get bit that you don't want bit.

richard,i'm so glad that you posted that.i have one of those "for real" gsds. i didn't train it in,it is natural.he will bite. he gives no physical,or verbal warning. if he thinks you don't belong in my yard,you are bit.for that reason,he now stays behind an electrified barricade.i can't be here to watch him around the clock.better safe than sorry. thanks again, just jt.

my pup (male)is going on 9 months and starting to be really aggressive....seems to be only when my wife is around him...he gives no warning except its seems that he gets this glaze in his eyes and bam....he starts rushing the person, barking and jumping toward the person...seems to only be towards females that he is doing this too...i hope i can train him not to be this way...hasn't bitten anyone yet...been able to control him before he got to anyone..why would he only do this towards the women (older ones and younger ones)?????????and the women were petting him and weren't afraid of him he just walked away from them and turned to face them then the glazey eyes and bam....

Will mentioned that the aggressor will be telegraphing his stress but I think it's also worth noting that the potential victim is also giving non-verbal information to his dog.I had a Keeshond that was 6 when I got him. He had been abused and it taught him 2 things. Not all people are nice and a deep growl has alot of power. He was large for his breed- about 55 pounds. There were several times walking late at night that he discouraged men from coming any closer. He didn't fool around with jumping and barking. He stood his ground and started growling. At the same time while I didn't give him any verbal commands he was aware if a person was making me uncomfortable. Even if you don't consciously identify a person as a threat you will be noticing if they're watching you, if they invade your personal space or if they are hurrying towards you. All of these things will cause you to experience stress and your dog will know it. Shadow never bit anybody but I think he would have if people hadn't moved away when they heard him growling. In any event a verbal command is only a small factor in the way you communicate with your dog.