Jon;
I use the collar in a different way. Remember, you dog does not have any orientation to the stimulation, so she will not understand what to do with it. I would suggest, pairing the low level stim with foundation training. Lure the dog with a piece of food into the down position, at the same time use your nick button pressing it three times, quickly, along with saying down.
Do this with all your commands that she knows. Then at least when you use it in the correction phase, she has a better chance of making the connection between what you want when she doesn't comply. Remember, she is a pup, and be sensitive to what drives she has and what kind of distractions you are expecting her to work thru. Error on the side of caution and you will make a lot of progress. Please work on attention, by being worth paying attention to. Motivate your dog to make correct decisions. Set her up for success!!!! I don't like correction based training, and I really question whether or not your pup is ready for the proofing and correction phase. Approaching the use of the collar by the way I suggested, is a fair way to help your dog.
Finding your dogs working level is very important. You just want to use the level of stimulation that causes an eye blink or
a slight stopping of head movement. On average, the working level in most dogs should be about 18-21 on a Dogtra 200.
Let me know how it goes.
Roni

Roni

I am a little confused. See if I got this straigt. To begin (dog first session w/collar but knows commands). Anyway, you lure the dog at the same time as tapping the nick button?
Isn't this correcting something that was asked for?
Do you mean use the tap like you would a leash pop if the dog DIDN"T comply?

Thanks

Thanks for the reply. After letting her get used to the collar for a couple of weeks, I will give it a shot. Her basics are pretty good - sit, down, stay, come - of course, though, this is with only minor distractions. In the house we have worked through a baby running around, doorbell, knocking, leaving the room on stays, etc. All of which work pretty well.

So what I gather from you is that the low stim is used to reinforce what the actual command is - with the three quick nicks? Is that right? Versus using it only as a correction. So the plan would be to keep sharpening her up this way before even trying to use it as a correction, right?

Thanks again for your advice.

Jon
I see the light.

Roni, please check if I've correctly understood what you've said in these and previous posts:

1. You don't use the e-collar for any corrections, and in foundational training you always use it in conjunction with the command.

2. When you give the very low level nick 3 times, you also say the command 3 times along with it.

In #1, at what level training do you find you can remove the collar and if the dog at some point does not obey, do you put the collar back on and go back a step or two?

In #2, if indeed you do give the command 3 times, when do you narrow it down to giving the command only once?

Also, if a dog has been trained differently with the e-collar than how you do it (I've used it for corrections), would it be terribly confusing to the dog to start using the collar as part of the command? Would he continue to associate the collar with correction instead of the command?

Ok now I am back to confused. I thought Roni just STARTED that way and then went on to use it as a correction once the stim is understood?

WOW! I confuse easily. In my defence I just got the collar and dvd last week.

1. You don't use the e-collar for any corrections, and in foundational training you always use it in conjunction with the command.

2. When you give the very low level nick 3 times, you also say the command 3 times along with it.

In #1, at what level training do you find you can remove the collar and if the dog at some point does not obey, do you put the collar back on and go back a step or two?

In #2, if indeed you do give the command 3 times, when do you narrow it down to giving the command only once?

Also, if a dog has been trained differently with the e-collar than how you do it (I've used it for corrections), would it be terribly confusing to the dog to start using the collar as part of the command? Would he continue to associate the collar with correction instead of the command?

Yes on #1 and #2. I use the collar thru out all three phases in dog training, as each exercise is at a different stage. I use the collar for corrections for pack behavior issues, but again I adjust the level for what I am doing.
When the dog understands the word, under distractions, by performing the task, at 80% fluency, I then move the dog to the correction phase for that exercise. As far as reducing the number of repetitions for the word again, it is on an individual basis. I say the word sit, under low level distraction, and if the dog sits, I need to say it only once. Dogs learn thru repetition, so I let the dog tell me.
I have taught a number of dogs using this method, after they have had the collar used only for corrections (some really have had terrible experiences)and because the dog does not percieve the stimulation as a negative, true learning occurs at an accellerated rate.
Michelle; A collar can be used in the correction phase, but the dog has to progress to that stage.
I hope this clears up any confusion.
Since Jon has had some experience with the collar on another dog, i thought he might enjoy trying something new.

Sorry guys, trying to figure out this editing stuff,lololol.
In my previous post. #1 and 2 and the following paragrah was quoted from Michele's post.

Got it. THanks

Thank you Roni, for explaining it. Very much appreciated.

Oh, I did forget to mention (my bad) that the corrections I've used the e-collar for were for pack related issues/corrections, not in command training. So guess I'm not doing too badly in that area, good to know.