 Re: Bite Work with Positive training only.
[Re: Lindsay Janes ]
#161628 - 11/07/2007 12:43 PM |
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I'm not so sure about showing human submission to the dog, Lindsay.
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Re: Bite Work with Positive training only.
[Re: Connie Sutherland ]
#161630 - 11/07/2007 12:46 PM |
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I'm not so sure about showing human submission to the dog, Lindsay.
Really? Did I do it wrong? He was being defensive at first when I asked him to go in the crate. Another day my mom was trying to displine him and he ran under the table. He showed his teeth to my mom, and then my sister told me to get him. He hasn't done it again. It was one time thing, not a repeat thing. (All this happen was a year ago).
"It's better to be an optimist who is sometimes wrong than a pessimist who is always right" |
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Re: Bite Work with Positive training only.
[Re: Lindsay Janes ]
#161634 - 11/07/2007 12:52 PM |
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I'm not so sure about showing human submission to the dog, Lindsay.
Really? Did I do it wrong? He was being defensive at first when I asked him to go in the crate. Another day my mom was trying to displine him and he ran under the table. He showed his teeth to my mom, and then my sister told me to get him. He hasn't done it again. It was one time thing, not a repeat thing.
I don't know, really, because I didn't see it. I have sat on the floor with a very panic-stricken dog.
I was reacting to this:
" I got on my knee (submissive position)"
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Re: Bite Work with Positive training only.
[Re: Connie Sutherland ]
#161644 - 11/07/2007 01:55 PM |
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Lindsay, I think it depends on the dog's reason for the behavior. With a frightened dog, which it sounds like this dog is, I don't see a problem w/getting a little lower in hopes of appearing less intimidating. OTOH, in general, I'd think what Connie thought about it. W/a serious or dominant dog, that is absolutely the wrong move. If dominance sparked it, the dog needs a correction he'll remember. If fear/past experiences sparked it, then I don't think appearing less intimidating is a terrible thing. JMO. Would have to see the whole thing to offer any more.
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Re: Bite Work with Positive training only.
[Re: Michael West ]
#161787 - 11/07/2007 08:30 PM |
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Acutally I dont really get where you are coming from at this point. Myself and Randy Allen gave you basically the same advice, when I gave it to you I said "this is a starting point." What are you expecting to hear ?
Dog training actually ivolves dog training, you have to actually train the kind of things we are talking about. They dont just happen in one training session. You have to build on things;
A starting point, the dog lets go of helper
Second the dog learns to let go of helper on your command for another bite.
Third, dog lets go of helper, recalls to you and then gets another bite.
Fourth dog lets go of helper comes to you and sometimes gets another bite.
Fifth dog is trained on a regular basis and has a good Out on command.
I really dont get why you cant see this. You have to train it.
Exactly what problems are you having with your K-9. Did the previouse handlers screw him up and now you can not get him to out no matter what you do?
Stop making excuses for your dog and start training it! |
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Re: Bite Work with Positive training only.
[Re: David Morris ]
#161790 - 11/07/2007 08:46 PM |
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David and Bob, I like your method of teaching the out.
How about the scenario where your dog starts to take off after a rabbit or deer and you need to recall?
Can you train that without corrections?
I'm not attacking your methods or anything, I'm genuinely curious, that's all 
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Re: Bite Work with Positive training only.
[Re: Yuko Blum ]
#161803 - 11/07/2007 09:13 PM |
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Probably not!!
In what I was descrbing I would be in control of the scenario. Jumping a rabbit and your dog instinctavely chasing it is something else I would think the E-collar would fix it. To try and fix that problem without corrections would mean that you would have to be able to duplicate the situation wich I really dont think you can.
Stop making excuses for your dog and start training it! |
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Re: Bite Work with Positive training only.
[Re: David Morris ]
#161807 - 11/07/2007 09:27 PM |
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Makes sense, thanks for clarifying!
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Re: Bite Work with Positive training only.
[Re: Yuko Blum ]
#161812 - 11/07/2007 09:50 PM |
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I know you didn't ask my opinion, but I'm going to chime in anyway. I live in high wild life area myself and the only thing I've found to work is OB. And more OB. Build trust and more OB. Takes time. Patience. And more OB.
The highly driven dogs seems to take a little longer. My 20 month GSD is doing pretty well, we can walk through the scent of deer, cats, squirrels, and fox without problems. The sight of birds is now a non issue. However the sight of any of the larger prey is still too much for her; gone to the end of the lead and I don't think the prong could get any tighter (she never seems to learn). Besides OB. and patience, the only other thing of importance I think I can add is, never ever let your dog run those prey, it'll make the job of recall a lot harder then it already is. That means, of course, no off lead work except under very controlled situations.
Patience.
If my dog isn't learning, I'm doing something wrong.
Randy
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Re: Bite Work with Positive training only.
[Re: Yuko Blum ]
#161813 - 11/07/2007 09:52 PM |
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Recall without correction?
Yes!
Here/Come is the absolute most important thing you'll ever teach your dog. If started with a young (7-12 wk) pup it's all about imprinting.
A young pup is completely dependant on it's littermates. Once you have that new pup, you are the littermate. When I take a new pup for a walk I make every effort to loose it. When the pup gets distracted, I hide behind a tree, building, etc. The pup starts to stress a bit when it realizes your gone. Step out, puppy's name and "come". ALWAYS REWARD THIS!
When I start hunting my terriers this works great. I also make a point of jumping lots of rabbits. If the dog knows a negative "stop", "fooie", "quit", it all a matter of stopping THE MOMENT THE PUP SEES THE QUARRY. You breaking the chain of see, stalk, chase.
My very first dod was killed by a car. That was almost 60 yrs ago. I haven't had a dog refuse a "Here" since.
Pavlov got a dog to slobber just by ringing a bell. It's just as easy to "imprint" a recall on a pup.
old dogs LOVE to learn new tricks |
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