 Re: Energetic Breeds--->Manners
[Re: Mark Rundle ]
#394418 - 10/14/2014 08:32 PM |
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Re: Energetic Breeds--->Manners
[Re: Mark Rundle ]
#394420 - 10/14/2014 10:35 PM |
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Saying the Bulldog was bred with a short face for better grip is like saying the GSD was bred with more angulation in order to make it a better herding dog.
BOTH are a result of show dog breeding. Nothing more then a look.
Bulldogs are one of a number of breeds that can't be born without a C section because the heads are to large to pass through the birth canal.
Chi dogs, Bostons are just two more breeds that have this issue.
old dogs LOVE to learn new tricks |
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Re: Energetic Breeds--->Manners
[Re: Bob Scott ]
#394422 - 10/14/2014 11:24 PM |
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There was a documentary with Bruce Fogle around the time the 'Pedigree Dogs Exposed' furore a couple of years ago, and they were in a type of natural history exhibition at a vets college - I think - and there was a stuffed Bulldog exhibit, which was about as far removed from the dogs showing today as it could be.
On the back of that programme, as well as the inevitable howls of protests from the breeders whose practices were exposed, there was an attempt to right the wrongs in the following years, and while some changes have been slightly noticeable, mostly the unscrupulous out there are still producing some worrying looking dogs. The KCC being one of these.
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Re: Energetic Breeds--->Manners
[Re: Mark Rundle ]
#394423 - 10/15/2014 01:03 AM |
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the thing seems to be there a lot of dogs in the show ring for a short amount of time, logically the word standard should give it away that the best dog would be the most average ie "standard" dog in the ring, the one that is in the middle range for everything, that's what makes it standard.
the problem is tho competitors have to catch the judges eye and having the most average dog doesn't do it, the dog a bit at the edge of the standard is an eye catcher hence gets out up.
everyone goes away then and tries to make their next gen a little bit more extreme and soon the whole thing is extreme piled on extreme to stand out in the crowd and the average "standard" dog becomes unrecognisable in it's own breed.
it is a self perpetuating feed back loop to hell.
but it makes people rich.
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Re: Energetic Breeds--->Manners
[Re: Bob Scott ]
#394427 - 10/15/2014 07:33 AM |
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Saying the Bulldog was bred with a short face for better grip is like saying the GSD was bred with more angulation in order to make it a better herding dog.
That is not what was said. Quoting from the page I linked, which is in agreement with the examples we were provided in our studies of heredity,...
"The typical lay-back (1), with the consequent recession of the nose (3) allowed the dog to maintain his grip without impeding his breathing."
I agree that the extremes have been exascerbated through selective breeding. However, there was originally a functionality in the brachycephaly of some breeds.
Sadie |
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Re: Energetic Breeds--->Manners
[Re: Duane Hull ]
#394433 - 10/15/2014 10:28 AM |
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Candi: I didn't just make that up. You should research.
Duane my cyber Friend, I have researched this in Depth 
LOL, and you should read through such research to its END -- "A wise-like underbite & backward-slanted nose" were thought to maximize grip & allow for better breathing while Bulldogs were locked-on ... ILLUSTRATIONS depicting the Skeletal Structure of ORIGINAL beasties As Opposed To the modern SHOW lines prove a Huge Difference in LENGTH of MUZZLE between "moderately short" and "Too SMUSH-FACED to Breathe".
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Re: Energetic Breeds--->Manners
[Re: tracey holden ]
#394434 - 10/15/2014 10:27 AM |
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There was a documentary...and they were in a type of natural history exhibition at a vets college - I think - and there was a stuffed Bulldog exhibit, which was about as far removed from the dogs showing today as it could be.
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Re: Energetic Breeds--->Manners
[Re: Mark Rundle ]
#394436 - 10/15/2014 11:14 AM |
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Candi: I have never disputed that the bulldog has been selectively bred to its detriment. I even agreed that it has become a caricature of itself. The original statement that I made, which you scoffed at, which I learned some 35-40 years ago, referred to the fact that the facial structure of the bulldog was intentionally selected to facilitate the dog's work; you even quoted the same in your second-to-last post. I said smushed face. I never suggested too smushed to breathe. That was the spin you put on my statement.
PLEASE take just a few seconds to read the page I linked. There is much detail explaining how ALL of the dog's physiological features were selected for his work, complete with diagrams and detail.
Sadie |
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Re: Energetic Breeds--->Manners
[Re: Duane Hull ]
#394438 - 10/15/2014 12:00 PM |
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Candi, I said SMUSHED face... There is much detail explaining how ALL of the dog's physiological features were selected for his work, complete with diagrams and detail.
Right U-R, Duane -- And such literature & material on the History of Bulldogs records & illustrates that the ORIGINAL beasties did NOT have a "smushed" face at all, but had instead a "moderately short" muzzle ... PEACE, Bro
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Re: Energetic Breeds--->Manners
[Re: Mark Rundle ]
#394439 - 10/15/2014 12:03 PM |
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It is quite obvious that my "smushed" and your "moderately short" are the same thing.
Peace, bro.
Sadie |
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