Heh Connie the dog I had then was actually in a crate at the time, luckily.

Randy .. close.. this incident was before I got into purebred cats. I was breeding Betas at the time and the fish was in a cup while I fixed part of the filtration system. I didn't want him harmed by anything I was doing so I put him in the go between cup.. I paid almost $200.00 for that darn fish... needless to say I only got through one batch of fry and raised around 75 fish to selling age and called it quits because I had too many problems with my system.

The cat got the evil eye and put in a different room rather than a frying pan lucky kitty.

P.S. Yeah cats can be tastey or so I hear.. about half of my dogs through life have been trustworthy on lead but I never leave them unsupervised. It isn't that I don't trust the dog, the cat was almost always the culprit.

I will concede about taking your comments a little strong Robbin. I'll have to watch for your other posts. LOL

I didn't want this to turn into a battle or cause harsh feelings. With the behaviors and dogs I have dealt with over the years that started out very similar to yours with dogs stealing food and getting braver and braver and start stealing food from kids and adults and seeing people after dogs started surfing the counters and get tore up because they addressed the problem too late or didn't address the problem soon enough.

The problem has seemed to become more of a problem since some of these purely positive progams have become popular and people poo pooing the pack structure of dogs. Not that I am not against positive reinforcement a dog needs to know the rules, boundaries, and limitations we set. And they need the proper amount of discipline. Some dogs will challenge its owner at different times over commands and rules they already know and have been trained to learn. It is natural for them to try and gain rank when they get the opportunity.

The counter surfing could potentially turn into a dangerous situation.

You mentioned the doggy door. I don't particulary care for the use of them because you are giving up some of the control over the dog because they go in and out at will. By doing this you give up some leadership. I am a firm believer to have 100% control over you dog 100% of the time. Most everything we think is bad behavior or consider unacceptable that dogs do are natural to them to do. We make them live by our rules and often forget to take care of their instincts. Sometimes it is a tough trade off for them.

Having multiple dogs in the house raises the bar for you as a pack leader also that compounds things. If you have set rules for the family to follow and they don't follow correct the family too. Getting everyone on the same page and being consistent is important too.

I have had really good success over the past 4-5 years working with the rescued dogs and the other dogs I work with in a group environment. The unstable dogs and/or dogs exhibiting behavior problems learn from the stable dogs during the rehabilitation process. One of the biggest things that I have learned is that taking care of and fulfilling the dogs needs first training and behavior issues become minor problems that are easily corrected.

Steve,

My children and I learned long ago to stay clear of the kitchen when my wife is cooking. She wants us out of her way. Our GSD, believe it or not, knows what "get out of the kitchen" means and clears out of there whenever he hears it.

Rich

Jenni,

I have to agree with you, that dogs do know when they have done something wrong. In my opinion, the saying "It's easier to get forgiveness than permission" was invented by a dog.

My dog has gotten up onto the counter, and the dining room table when it was being set for dinner. Interestingly enough, he has never done so when we had eyes on him, only when he was sure no one was looking. Unfortunately for him, our ears work pretty well But if that isn't proof that he knows taking food from the table or counter is wrong, I don't know what is.

It amazes me when I think about it, that my dog has learned things that we didn't ever set out to teach him. Like going into his crate at bedtime, even if we don't tell him to.

I think you are right, we underestimate them. Sometimes, I think they count on it

I haven't counted, but there seem to be about a hundred knowledgeable dog trainers on this board named Jennifer.

Rich

 Quote: randy allen

Everything set? Dig in! The dog goes stupid! Runs to the front door barking like crazy. 'What the.........I didn't hear anything, why does company always come at dinner time?' So I get up, because she will not leave it, what ever it is. I get to the front door, get her settled and open the door, huh, nobody there. I turn around to systematicly ask the dog about the issue, uh no dog. Puzzled I shut the door (puzzled because I'd never seen her scared, I niavely thought) and headed back to dinner and the game. Yeah you've guessed by now, I had no dinner left on my plate.

Our dogs did the exact same thing a couple of times before we caught on. The one who came up with the idea is the same one who decided to steal a cheesey tortilla right out of my hand. I shut the doggie door to block off his escape and then gave him hell while I chased him down and pried it out of his mouth. He never tried it again. Counter surfing is an ongoing problem at my house. We have just kind of accepted that everything needs to be put out of the dogs reach. I think I could solve the problem with the Can Monster trick or a few mousetraps but my parents would never go for it. Eventually they will probably get a hold of something toxic or important(expensive).

 Quote: john corbett

I will concede about taking your comments a little strong Robbin. I'll have to watch for your other posts. LOL

No sweat, JC, it's all good. Yea...just do a search w/my name and most times you will find one of three things..a)Me, asking stupid questions b)Me, giving somewhat good advice c)Acting as comic relief or Drama Queen.

 Quote:

I didn't want this to turn into a battle or cause harsh feelings. With the behaviors and dogs I have dealt with over the years that started out very similar to yours with dogs stealing food and getting braver and braver and start stealing food from kids and adults and seeing people after dogs started surfing the counters and get tore up because they addressed the problem too late or didn't address the problem soon enough.

Understandable, thing is...I know the dogs have been stealing, I've just NEVER caught them. I know they are teaching the baby how to be naughty, too Aside from that, don't worry about ME every getting tore up, I'm an ex-old schooler, remember? Not a name I wear with pride but they'd be having a "meetin Jesus" meeting real quick!

 Quote:

The counter surfing could potentially turn into a dangerous situation.

Yes, and that would be a shame because then I could legitimately kick some butt! heeheehee

 Quote:

You mentioned the doggy door. I don't particulary care for the use of them because you are giving up some of the control over the dog because they go in and out at will. By doing this you give up some leadership. I am a firm believer to have 100% control over you dog 100% of the time. Most everything we think is bad behavior or consider unacceptable that dogs do are natural to them to do. We make them live by our rules and often forget to take care of their instincts. Sometimes it is a tough trade off for them.

This is true, we do make them live by our rules. JenniferM reminded me yesterday that once the alpha walks away, it's to each his own on the food. My bad, yep, my bad. I think the thing that ticks me off the most is that "she" or "he" is brazen enough, after all these years of knowing better, to start trying to push the letter. Again...my bad. Since the incident, I have not allowed any dogs into the kitchen. I too, have an "out of the kitchen" command and all dogs scatter. We've made the mistake of letting Bandit forage around after the kids. Not going to allow that anymore. This morning one of the kids spilled cereal on the floor, dog automatically came running, knowing that is usually allowed. NOPE!! NOT TODAY, SUCKA! Only time they will be allowed is if I say so. I also had all of them either kenneled, outside (on my command) or in the same room with me. HAH! TAKE THAT! YOU EVIL CREATURES! Oh, alright so they aren't evil...just opportunistic.

 Quote:

Having multiple dogs in the house raises the bar for you as a pack leader also that compounds things.

Yep, yep. I have a couple of extra, want one?

oh calm down people, I'm only joking!





Edited by RobbinMann (01/16/2008 08:18 AM)
Edit reason: had to put in the "meeting Jesus" comment!

Sheesh, after reading over my last post and the comments I made about "meetin Jesus" and "I get to legitimately kick some butt" I realized, there might be some around here that might get the impression I actually wanted to hurt my dogs.

Not so, I never would want to hurt my dogs. Only in the event I had to protect myself or my children would anything ever come to that. So, I was just kidding. Before someone says, "that's not funny" or "that's nothing to joke about" I figured I would say..

TAKE IT EASY PEOPLE, I'M JUST JOKING!

Hope that clears up any misconcieved notions...

Note to self: Create post informing ppl of my warped sense of humor.

You understand? Dont you Jenni? LOL

I don't care what you say, Robbin......Jazzman (her "evil" she-dog) is NOT evil

She's a very good girl...with spunk..........(waiting for a meteorite shower, courtesy of Robbin)

Robbin...you kill me. I don't even need my morning coffee when you're up and posting. I hope you never change!