George,

Go back and read the origional post and tell me you think these people are going to be able to handle this situation. If you don't believe that these people can handle this situation then following the advice you have given will create just the situation I describe. I have seen this happen often to the detriment of the dogs. If you honestly believe that these people can handle this situation then you aren't suggesting that they wait for a disaster, if you don't believe they can handle this situation then that is exactly what you are suggesting. You didn't come out and say it, but it is the logical conclusion to following your present advice.

I don't think that waiting to handle what looks like a disaster in the making is wise. The breed is bred to fight, not all are as game as others but to expect that these dogs are going to get along is to invite disaster. But again is this the likely conclusion to this situation based on what you have seen written by the origional post? In addition to the potential for physical injury, if the poster waits to deal with the situation you have the additional problem of the emotional attachment of the owner to the dogs. I think that would likely delay the handeling of the situation and potentially make it worse.

So I come back to my origional question:
Do you really believe that these people can handle this situation?

J and Richard-

You are doing such a great job that I hate to butt in, but I will anyway with this teeny-tiny observation <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" /> :

George wrote:

***Just because they are pit bulls doesn't mean that they are gamebred fighting monsters that can't be controlled and taught proper etiquette.***

Bmatis wrote:

***I've been researching and talking to breeders on the internet and the person I talked to has bred red nosed pitbulls for 25 years and said from the paperwork that they were well bred puppies. Top of the line pitbulls.***

Aren't "top of the line pitbulls" game bred, by definition?

 Quote:

Aren't "top of the line pitbulls" game bred, by definition?

Well, I've never seen "so-so" puppies advertised. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />

As far as raising pit bulls, my puppy (3 months) is obedient and well-behaved around me, because I reinforce good behavior-jumping up and acting like a fool gets her nothing, while sitting politely or playing with her toys earn attention and treats.

I'd highly recommend "Purely Positive Training", a book Ed sells.

***Aren't "top of the line pitbulls" game bred, by definition?***

Yes, they are, but gameness is not the same as agressiveness. A game dog is a steady, stable, docile dog who would rather die than give up on the job he is doing. That is any kind of job - his job is whatever his master tells him to do. A good game-bred pitbull will not fight his worst enemy if you tell him not to. Gameness is the trait that reveals itself (in a minor way) in my pitbulls when my husband takes them to his preschool classroom and they are swarmed by 4-year-olds and they don't flinch when their tails and ears are pulled, or when my rooster pecks them hard on the nose and they simply walk away because they know they are allowed to protect the chickens, but not touch them. Rather than acting agressive when physically provoked, game dogs will act however they think you want them to act - even if they are really getting hurt.

Gameness is a trait that will make an agressive dog more dangerous, but it has nothing to do with a dog being agressive in the first place, and there are a lot of aggressive dogs who are not game. If you are dealing with "top-of-the-line," game-bred pitbulls, you can easily train them not to be aggressive. It is pretty doubtful that these dogs we are talking about are top-of-the-line. But the bad dog agression you see in a lot of pitbulls doesn't have to do with gameness - it has to do with poor breeding and bad training.

The difference between gameness and aggression is beside the point. Regardless of breed, I would never recommend to the average person trying to raise two puppies at once! I wouldn't even do it myself! It's just too much to deal with, and too difficult to give each pup the amount of training and attention they need when you have more than one. No, it's not impossible, but I don't know of any reputable breeder who would recommend that the average person take TWO of their pups!

People have different definitions as to what "top of the line" means , it could be show and it could mean for work.
Cnielsen really hit the nail on the head with her description of these dogs.
These were referred to as "rednose" pits right? Wel I put that in AOL searc engin and this was the first site I came up with::

Red Nosed Pits

Take a look at their photos and you will see multiple pits together. Read the fact sheet.
Funny part is , that I don't even own pits and I am defending them! <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/confused.gif" alt="" /> but the truth is the truth.
Maybe Bmatis is on vacation? lol

George <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />

Well its looks like I stired up the possum a bit...
The main point I was trying to make is that dogs have been selectively breed to perform a certain function. Is anyone going to disagree that pits were bred to fight and kill other dogs? If that is the case I just dont see the point in owning them. Their as ugly as a hat full of arse holes and as dumb as dog shit. It dosent take a lot of intellect to fight and kill so intellgience has never been a breed worthiness criteria. Wheres the the strenght of breeding in them? The german breeds have pedigrees going back tens of generations with schutzhund scores to make some sort of assesment of the dogs intelligence and stability. Wheres that for these dogs? The illiterate back slappin' cousin' kissin' types that breed these dogs dont even know there own pedigrees let alone that of their dogs.

Its simply a matter of horses for courses, these dogs were bred to kill other dogs, any other use of them is a compromise. Lifes hard enough, why make it harder by making a rod for your own back.

Your right about my mate being dumb getting all those dogs, I told him to get just one and train it well, hes not like that though he has to have lots of everthing. Hes a smart guy otherwise, makes a lot of money in I.T.. He paid $1800 australian for each of them.

Your right about the dog bite and the preemptibe antibitoics too, it was just a small bite but it shows what can happen.
Yes, I know dogs lick their arses, my rott bitch eats horse shit and cow as well and even snacks on human fudge if she can get at it. I think its the most disgusting sub human act in the world when people let thier dogs lick their faces, they might as well just go right ahead and lick the dogs arse and genitals for him as well. Cut the 'middle man right out' and get straight to the real deal.

Once again Brendan "the troll" speaks.
He may have some people kissing his ass here but I won't.
You (Diplomat) should learn something about these dogs before you talk trash.
Most any well bred APBT can trace its pedigree back to the early 1900's. Some even further, all the way to the first dogs that came from Ireland.
Good breeders did and still do plan their breedings far, even years in advance.
Crack open a book and read about Bob Wallace, Louis Colby, Floyd Boudreaux, Earl Tudor, etc.
It is unfortunate that there are persons reading these messages that would give you some sort of credibility regarding these dogs. You are good for laughs though.
There is a lot of good info on this board, but for APBT facts, you gotta overlook "The Diplomat", for he is without a clue...

Ted, #1:Anybody asking if its possible to keep two pits together like that, probably could stand to hear some of brendans advice....#2 Don't worry, anybody who would take one mans thoughts as the end all truth, is a @&#@ fool.....#3:I could not stop laughing for a long while after reading that, AND he certainly IS thought prevoking. That's good enough for me. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/laugh.gif" alt="" />

If you take him with a grain of salt, then he's not so bad! The only thing I would point out is that APBTs were NOT bred to kill other dogs. That's a misperception that I hate to see perpetuated. Yes, some yahoos have and do breed them for the purpose of pit fighting, but they are in a small minority, and are not considered knowledgable breeders.