Sorry Philip, I missed this part in my last post.

Ramsey Case ........... My personal opinion in this case is that a protection dog would not of helped that little girl.

Nuff Said.

Jerry

 Quote:

Originally posted by philip stenson:
GSD's And Rotts are in the statistics only because there are numerically a lot more of them.

Another thing to add about the high amount of GSD bites. This does include PSD bites, there is no separation between non PSD and PSD bites in the records. Another reason why GSDs are near the top of the list for "biters".

For some hard data on the breeds and bites, see the Center for Disease Control papers on dog bites.

http://www.cdc.gov/ncipc/duip/dogbites.htm

Especially, http://www.cdc.gov/ncipc/duip/dogbreeds.pdf

Short story is that in recent years, Rots & Pit Bulls are responsible for over half of the dog bite fatalities (16/27 in 1997-1998, 14/26 in 1995-1996). It's not likely that pits and rotties made up over 50% of the dog population for those years. German Shepherds had two in 1991-92 and again in 1995-96. In the last years of the survey, Shepherds had a steady decline in the number of deaths. Strangely, even a Cocker Spanial had one death attributed to it. (Data from second reference). In general there are about 10-12 deaths due to dog bites in the US each year.

To put these numbers in perspective, prior to the aggressive campaign to put children in the back seat, air bags killed children at twice that rate. According to the NHTSA, from 1996 through 2001, air bags killed 191 people, 116 of them children. http://www.nsc.org/news/nr082801.htm

Not to beat a dead horse, but they catagorize almost any dog that has a erect ears a GSD, Mastiff type body is a pitt or rottweiler. I also stand corrected that a protection dog would not have helped in the Ramsey case, I agree, I meant Elizabeth Smart. One of the main reasons I have a protection trained dog is to protect my kids at home. I can take care of myself they can't.
Also, if you look at the statistics, multiple dogs are often involved in fatalities. I personally would never have 2 dogs at once roam free in my house. The pack mentality feeds on itself.

Getting back to the original thread, I have my kids feed the dog or give him treats (supervised). I think in a dogs mind, he who controls the food is higher in the ranks.

Check out Ed's article on

<link>Will my protection trained puppy be safe with my family.

It has some good tips on what to do and what to watch for. Watch for the dog standing over the kids -- that's a dominance move. Watch for the dog jumping on a kid's back -- again, a dominance move.

Three short stories about working line dogs & kids.

I have a working line (Leerburg) male and a friend has a Leerburg female. Both dogs truly love kids. One of Chance's big pleasures is to go next door and play with the neighbor's young daughters. He also loves to stop by the local KinderCare center and let the little kids pet him. However, I do supervise him when he is having is play dates. He's big enough that he could inadvertantly knock a child down. Additionally, some kid's don't know how to behave around a dog. He puts up with that but I don't permit it.

Last summer, Dallas, the female, was with her owner on a neighborhood camping trip. She was making certain Gayle assembled the tent correctly. Suddenly, she pricked her ears and was off in a black & tan flash. When Gayle caught up to her, she found Dallas washing the neighbor kid's face. He was crying after falling down. Dallas was doing her best to make it all better.

Back in the late 60's one of my cousins was on the Denver K-9 squad. His dog was retired after he hit the helper and dislocated the helper's shoulder, broke three ribs and punctured a lung. The department decided he was just a bit too strong for what they wanted. My cousin took him home to be the family dog. Made a great playmate for his kids and the neighorhood kids. Only problem was the kids couldn't play cops & robbers or cowboys & indians. The dog would sneak up behind and steal the toy gun from the holster. Then he would run off and bury it.

On the other hand, you can get a dog that you don't want anywhere near children. Any idea of how other dogs from that breeder have acted around children?

Finally, if you haven't already, get Ed's puppy tape.

Oops. Wrong URL to the link. Check out Ed's article on working line dogs & kids.

http://www.leerburg.com/dominanc.htm

IMO most dogs socailized and brought up with kids that interacting with them, (unless something goes wrong with them) are good around kids.

Coming up we were left alone with the family dog alot. I had a Black GSD that use to play foot ball with in a pack of 10 kids 7-8 yrs old. With occassional supervison, though he was the families dog, he was partial to my two kids. I feed him and worked him and they played with him. Kids would come by to play with him, which I neevr allowed unless one of my cids were present.

Small Kids could come in the back yard, but strange adults and teenagers couldn't, not even short a/t? I never figured out what he was keying on.

But now I would never leave a working dog, alone with small kids. If something went wrong the kids doesn't have a chance, except to tuck and cover, maybe.

Family pet/protectors are ok with the kids sometimes they will be left alone, form time to time. Usually the dog knows his job is to protect the child/children.

But some dogs from the Real world or Prey monster field are too predictable. If you startle them or hurt them ,they will bite accidental or on purpose. A child even one that has dog training skills, should not be left alone with this type animal.

Ob and socailization is the Key. IMO.