Quote: tanith wheeler

He will walk nicely off leash with treats and she uses treats for control work - ignoring his bad behaviour and staying calm seems to work far better in those circumstances.
He does stand very nicely.

But when on lead he just wants to go and see other dogs etc. Totally ignoring toys / treats. If the lead goes tight or he is corrected that is when he will walk on two legs, jump about etc. If you correct then he will bite - it doesn't hurt or mark but I would still class it as a bite. His claws do damage when he jumps on you.

Are the surrounding environments the same between the off leash scenario and the on leash work? I'm guessing off leash work is done in the quietude of home and it's easy to get him to focus on food, whereas the on leash work where he goes nuts over other dogs is done at the show, or a similar dog-crowded environment? If so, they don't really compare, and it doesn't mean food motivation and positive reinforcement won't work on this dog, it just means the training needs to be broken down into simpler steps for the dog.

This sounds like an overly exuberant adolescent dog who just needs a lot more work with overall focus and manners before he goes into the show ring. No, he can't wear the prong into a show, but he can wear one while he's worked in distraction training just outside the show - he needs to be started with enough distance between other dogs that his handler CAN easily get his attention back (that might be a ways away), using voice and treats to do that. Ignoring a command to "watch me" or "heel" should get him a correction, and the second he gets it right, he gets praise. Praise and reward should be just as important as well timed corrections.

I can't speak to the use of an E collar for this, but in terms of training, distraction/focus work would be what I'd start with - and for everyone's sanity, I'd start with as little distraction as possible and SLOWLY work my way up. The goal being that the handler eventually won't be dependent on the prong collar to get this dog to focus on him/her, even under the hectic distraction of a dog show - as Melissa said, the dog should really want to work WITH the handler more than anything else. JMO

~Natalya

Thank you all for your help and advice I will pass on your suggestions.

Off-lead and on-lead are done in the same environment with the same distractions.
Thanks again

Is it possible?

It sure must be, I have done it.
But, I have trained more dogs with e-collars than with prongs collars.

I would suggest getting an e-collar, that will be a huge help in off leash work. If used properly, it's such an amazing tool.

*Mod delete* Ted, check your PMs. Thanks.

 Quote: tanith wheeler

A slip collar does not give enough control. Any recomendations on an alternative?

Use motivation, either through toys or food. Get the dog to want to walk in the correct position. Use the dog's drives to get what you want from the dog. This is more difficult than compulsion, but way more effective.

I'll recommend Sheila Booth's book, Schutzhund Obedience: Training in Drive. It has an excellent chapter on "Happy Heeling." You can buy the book on this site. I'm on my 3rd time reading it. It's awesome.

Ted,

No insulted intended on your post.

I don't allow any mention of anything to do with Fred Hassen on my web board. He was kicked off this board years ago.

In my opinion they guy knows little to nothing about good dog training. He is 100% a "remote collar avoidance trainer" who would not recognize motivational training if it was stairing him in his face. The only thing he is good at is self promotion and thats not about to happen on my web board.

So thats why it was deleted.

Ed