Thanks Ian. I will think about thinks, when I buy prongs and DDs. I have already read about this, but there are many things to consider so it is very helpful if someone points to certain things.

 Quote: Bob Scott

I look at the DD collar as more of a support collar for the pinch as mentioned above or a control collar for the truly dominant dog.

In that instance it can often take a strong person, both physically and mentally to use one properly.

Does that mean you wouldn't use, if you're not sure if your dog is really dominant?

Thanks to you all for the great practical advises how to manage those damned scary devices. Some printed texts more on my doggie wall!

remember what you are using these for . . . . sending information to the dog .

so if the dog is responding appropriately to a DD alone , you don't need a prong .

have you done leash pressure work first ?

if you train the dog to understand what is expected of him , you may not need to bring out " bigger guns " , if you know what i mean .

and every dog is different . my border collie took to leash pressure work right away . he still forges at times because he is still learning where to be , but just the lightest touch on the lead ( i'm using a slip lead ) will put him right in place .


( off topic : i have a friend from canada who relocated to curitiba when he married a brazilian woman . he recently vacationed in bahia . it looks beautiful . he brought me a T-shirt from there lol . )

 Quote: Christina Stockinger

Thanks to you all for the great practical advises how to manage those damned scary devices.

Oh no, don't be "scared", Christina

These tools will NOT hurt your dogs !!! Both a DD and a Prong must virtually be abused on purpose in order to do harm to the animal, and you are Too Kind AND Too Smart to misuse either one intentionally...

The DD is just a slip-collar made of tightly woven cloth fibers with a snap-fastener on one end, so that it is NOT put on OVER the head, but attaches Around the Neck instead (like a buckle collar) -- This allows it to be Shorter in Length and Fit more Snuggly than a traditional choke-chain, so the dog CANNOT "back his head out of it" if he tries to escape the leash ... The DD is my personal Collar of Choice for ALL dogs of ANY temperament, due to its being convenient, escape-proof & humane (it can be attached to a leash, either on the "live" ring OR the "dead" ring, same as any traditional slip-collar)

The PRONG will NOT harm your dog unless you use it to suspend the animal with all 4 feet off the ground for an extended time, which I know you would NEVER do -- Its little "teeth" are NOT sharp like Lancets ... It does NOT work by "pricking like needles", but simply by PINCHING the SKIN between each link when a Correction is Applied

Prong collars are typically useful on dogs who Forge and/or Lunge while being trained to heel properly, and a Prong is particularly helpful to handlers who are NOT stronger than their K9 -- That's why Ed Frawley calls them "power-steering for dogs" Properly Fitting a PRONG and Properly Correcting the DOG while using one is important BECAUSE they are WORTHLESS if worn too loose OR the dog is allowed to Pull into Them (not because you will harm your animal by using one).

To add to what Candi said above I think the DD collar is generally to thin to be used for training.

That will be harder on your hands then it will be on the dog's neck unless, as mentioned, it's abused.


The key to both pinch collar and DD collar is to keep then high on the neck right behind the ears and snug.

Both will be ineffective if used low and or loose on the dog's neck.

I guess you all have convinced me. I will read and watch how to manage this and then give it a try. Thanks, thanks!

Yes, Bob, I have done lleash pressure work. The dogs respond on this well. But there are certain situations especially with the bigger Pit, where it becomes difficult. I certainly will have to go some steps back with distractions, actually I have already done this and will add new or higher level distractions very carefully. But I can imagine, that Prong + DD could make things easier. I will have to learn thus.
Thanks again.