Thanks to you all for the advise but its still not as technical as i would have expected it to be.Att VAN CAMP yes i have worked civilly but he still thinks this is no threat to him .ED FRAWLEY if u are around would you please address this issue.and what is this tape on DEFENCE. I have a copy of ;the first steps of bite training and training personal protection dogs,on the subject and a lot more.KEVIN SHELDAHL where are you need your help on this one.DENNIS HASLEY do not take long .anxiously waiting

The expert are busy. Sometimes when it sounds like you are fishing they don't want to bait your hook, cast your rod and reel it in for ya. They want you to read and study.

Defense drive can be tested and brought out in several different ways, Civil training were the decoy is stationed in a safe area and he is without a prey item/sleeve and he acts threatening.

You have the dog on leash, you and the decoy have worked out a saftey zone for the decoy, (this an designated line or marking the dog cannot cross for the safety of the decoy). The decoy agitates the dogs and once he gets him really worked up, he runs and hide. For a begining dog once the dogs perks up or growls he should run, (pending the dogs experince). Your dog seems to have the confidence so they can work him to the point where he is lunging and bark at the decoy, before he runs.

I like my decoys after the dogs worked up to give the impression that he is trying to get past the dog to get to me. This is done by motioning over the dogs head with his arms one at a time, this seems to really upset him. After this done the decoy puts a oversize shirt on that fits over the sleeve and lures the dog in to get a bite usually there is some snarling and tharashing unlike the prey bite. The sleeve is released and the decoy stand behind the marked line (now un-sleeved) and pulls the attention of the dog off the sleeve to him again.

These are some fair drills for working defense, I particularly like the surprise attack from upwind on the helper, the dog should intervne before the decoy gets to the handler. Be careful here because its a surprise attack the dog, may not go for the sleeve my dog jumped up for the decoys face. Its a good thing we had a safety zone already assigned, it was inches away from his face, well maybe 10" inches. He hit the ground and scooted away.

Be careful!! Get Eds Defense building tape. I worked with some guys that don't like GSD and prefered beefier dogs, thy are now believer that size don't matter teeth does. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />

Mike,
Perhaps you should go back through some of the archives and read numerous post on this subject. You can find plenty of answers here.

Also it may just be as simple as, the dog just doesn't have what it takes for real person driven combat. Most do not... Some may be "civil" and put on the bluff or defense, some may even take a shot at a person in defense but this does not a street worthy dog make.

It may just be the dogs is lacking the ability. I think Lou Castle said it best, “you can't make chicken salad out of chicken s$#@.”

Not a put down to your or any dog, it just means you can't put something there that is genetically missing in the dogs ability.

I think you should purchase the tape "The First Steps of Defense" that Ed sells.

I think it is one of his better tapes and one that a lot of people should see.

IF your dog has what it takes, but just has a very high threshold for defense then you need to up the pressure.

Try doing some training at night. First try taking a walk around your neighborhood and have a decoy hidden alone your path somewhere. At a pre-arrainged time have him act very suspicious (without any prey movements) and approach you and the dog. Watch and be careful that the decoy is aware of what to look for in your dog and knows when to make scared and take off.

That should get a little more defensive actions out of your dog.

If not, try doing it closer to home at night. Like have a person enter your backyard playing prowler while you have your dog on leash and do the same thing. The bad guy isn't inciting your dog with any prey movements like a SchH helper, but is really a weirdo slinking into your territory to do some evil. You have to play it up.

When you are on your home territory your dog will most likely be more edgy about strangers doing weird stuff.

The key is to take baby steps, at the first sight of any defense or suspician from your dog the decoy needs to take notice and begin to act a little different. Maybe afraid or just freeze like he has been caught with his hand in the cookie jar. With forward motion from your dog, a little hackle, and ideally growling or barking in defense the decoy must react in fear and get the heck out of dodge. You are showing the dog that he has power, but only when he makes good forward movement and is "serious" in his intentions. i.e. he barks deep, and with some tooth. He is really a little on edge at this new threat.

Get the tape, it has such a great set up for doing civil agitation for begining dogs.

Think of what your goals are and be creative. Try to get your dog in strange places, with threats that he hasn't seen yet, then reward him for good responses. That will help bring out his defense, and show him that not everything is fun and games.

Thanks for the answers Don B Ackerson Josh lewis and Van camp.The subject is a 3 YEAR OLD ROTTWEILLER male and i should get back to you in a couple of weeks time anyone with Rott experience can chip in