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Dog Parks: Why They Are A Bad Idea

Dog Parks

Why They Are A Bad Idea

by Ed Frawley

This article will detail three topics concerning dog parks:

The original purpose of dog parks
The problems and dangers of taking your dog to a dog park.
How to prepare for a dog park
How to handle and protect your dog while in the dog park

The Purpose Of
A Dog Park

It would seem pretty obvious that a dog park is a place for people who don't have a lot of personal space to take their dog for exercise. The perfect example would be apartment dwellers or people who live in big cities.

The second and possible more common reason (which I disagree with) is that a dog park is a place for a dog to socialize with other dogs.

The Dangers of Dog Parks

Every couple of days I get an email from someone asking about problems with their dogs being attacked when they are on walks or running loose at one of the local parks that many cities setup.

People also question me on how to deal with overly aggressive dogs that belong to other pet owners. They also question me about their own dogs not trying to defend themselves when approached by a seemingly aggressive dog. Some people want to know if they should just let the dogs work these problems out themselves.

I want to go on record as saying that the concept of ”Dog Parks” was well intended but a bad idea, especially when dogs are allowed to run off-leash. The main problems all stem from people who don't understand and have not established pack structure with their dogs. This means their dogs are out of control.

The average dog owner does not take the time to understand much less install pack structure. They don't know how strong the pack instincts are in their family pets. These drives can and often do click into high gear when a dog is taken into a park with strange dogs.

When a new dog comes into a park that other dogs visit every day the new visitor is often seen an an intruder into “the personal territory" of the regular visitor. More often than not they are not seen as new found friend. This often leads to either to territorial aggression, dominance aggression or fear aggression.

Dog Packs in the Park

When a group of dogs (3 or more) are allowed to run together in an area where there are no strong pack leaders (human pack leaders), they instinctively try to establish a rank order (or pecking order). If there are several dogs that want to assume a certain rank within this new pack there are often problems. Too often this results in dog fights to determine what rank a dog will assume.

dog park It is a mistake to assume that every dog in the park is a well-mannered, well-trained pet. Just because it playing with other dogs does not mean that it will play with your dog. The issue of rank has already been settled with these other dogs and the game may be going according to their rules. Your dog will not know the rules and can easily get into trouble. To often when a fight breaks out between your dog and the leader of this pack the other dogs in the pack will also jump in and go after your dog.

I get emails from people who are disappointed in their puppy or young dog because it shy's away from other dogs and shows avoidance to these strange dogs they meet on walks or in parks. These people completely misunderstand pack structure, many don't even know that it exists.

The vast majority of dogs don't want to be pack leaders. They are perfectly happy with their owners assuming the position of leader. As such these dogs expect their pack leader (their owner) to protect them. That's why these dogs will run to their owner when they fell threatened by another dog. When a handler does not protect his dog the dog is in conflict and loses confidence. When the owner ignores the perceived threat their dogs often move into fight or flight.

When you stop to think about it, normal people would never expect their young children to fight adults that were threatening their home. So why do people expect their young dogs to show aggression to older dogs? In most cases, the owners simply lack the understanding of pack drive and dog training. People get caught in the trap of thinking they have a German Shepherd from working police bloodlines and "BY DOG" it should be tough!! Well, it doesn't work that way.

When new owners assume the position of pack leader and they do everything right when their pup is young the dog will grow up to be a confident adult dog. When owners drop the pack structure ball their dogs grow up to be basket cases (either overly aggressive or fearful) This is the reasons I do never guarantee temperament in the pups I used to sell. Too many people lacked common sense or the experience to properly raise a dog.

How to Handle Your Dog in the Dog Park

When your dog is approached by a dog that looks like it may be aggressive YOU (not your dog) needs to take the aggressors role.

Dogs that have the potential to be aggressive are going to have a stiff body. Their legs will be stiff, often their tail will be straight up in the air or straight back (never tucked under the stomach - that's a submissive posture). When another dog does this it's to make itself look bigger and stronger.

Dominant dogs will T-OFF on your dog. That means stand at your dogs shoulder and put their muzzle over the shoulders of your dog. This is a dominant display. When you see this:

1- Tell the dogs owner that he or she needs to get control of their dog.

2- If this does not work, then it's time to leave the park. If there was any aggression you may want to file a complaint or police report. Make sure you indicate that you were concerned for your personal safety and your dogs.

3- If the situation has moved beyond the point where you can leave then you need to take things in your own hands. Verbally tell the dog in a deep voice to get out of there. Usually (not always) this is enough to make the dog back off. When that happens you need to determine if you have solved the problem or if you need to leave. Always error on the side of safety.

4- I would not go to a dog park without a walking stick or a can of pepper gas. If you are not familiar with how to safely break up a dog fight without getting hurt you need to familiarize yourself with what to do. (Read the article or listen to the podcast I have done on this)

5- What I do may not be possible for many people with less experience. But if a stray dog were to get aggressive with my dog and I could not verbally threaten the dog to make it move on I would attack the dog with the stick. I can hear all the PETA PUKE rolling their eyes as they read this, but the fact is by this point retreat is not an option and I would not allow my dog to be hurt. Often times one good HARD HARD hit right between the ears will deter most dogs. If you don't have the confidence to do this, call the authorities because this dog does not belong in the park.

If another dog attacks your dog you need to do what I explain in my article on Breaking Up A Dog Fight. If I were to walk a dog in the city, I would not do it without a can of pepper gas to use on any dog that even looks cross-eyed at my puppy. I would not hesitate to physically go after a dog that approaches my pup. The only ones that would be allowed to come close would be dogs I know for a fact are well-mannered, friendly soles that will be tolerant and play with my puppy.

While some breeds are predisposed to fight more than others, every breed has it's own bullies. There are too many people out there that don't come close to the label of being a “responsible pet owner.” With the number of fighting breeds growing, the risks of taking your pet to one of these parks is growing every day.

Pet owners should know that once a puppy or adult dog has been attacked by another dog, it will become a dog aggressive animal itself. This only has to happen one time for a permanent temperament change to occur in some animals. You will quickly find that dog aggression is a real pain in rear.

Finally, if your dog is a bully and is aggressive to other dogs, you need to explain to him that this is unacceptable behavior. Softer dogs can get the message with a simple verbal reprimand, while other dogs need to have serious corrections. These corrections can come from a prong collars, a dominant dog collars or in some cases a remote collar. (One should only use a remote collar after they have had the proper training)

The correction for serious dog aggression needs to be so hard enough that the dog remembers it the next time it thinks about being aggressive.

The bottom line for professionals it the correction needs to be so severe that the idea of fighting or showing aggression is not as strong as the respect (or fear) of what happens when he does not mind. For these dogs the presence of another dog is a big distraction, but they need to understand that if they allow this distraction to take control them the punishment will be swift and severe. Once they understand this simple concept they will become much better dogs.

Giving a dog this kind of correction is often not a pretty sight. Many people do not have the temperament or skill to do it correctly. They simply cannot bring themselves to correct at an effective level. Dog fights are a serious business and these people should either seek professional help or find a new home for their dog aggressive dog.

In my opinion one of the most effective tools for trainers who want to learn how to administer corrections at a level beyond their normal strength level (IE. a small women with a large dog) is to learn to train with a remote collar. I have produced a training DVD titled Remote Collar Training for the Pet Owner which covers the foundation of collar training.

If you have a dog that needs a little help with distraction training I would direct you to my training video on Basic Dog Obedience. This tape will guide you through normal distraction problems. It will explain the principles of correction and how to read a dog’s temperament to determine what level of correction to use.

People with dominance problem in their dog should never bring their dog to dog parks until they have the dominance issues under control. I tell people "if you can't control your dog at home or on a walk how will you ever control this dog when it's in a dog park with 20 other dogs?"

If you have a dominant dog I recommend my DVD Dealing with Dominant and Aggressive Dog

Recommendations to make dog parks safer places:

While I am lucky to live in a small community and have acreage to exercise and train, I know that others that live in large cities don't have an option to where they can go with their dogs. The following information is designed to help people make dog parks a safer place.

Dogs should pass a test before being allowed in a dog park.
In my opinion communities should establish and set up tests that pet owners must pass before dogs are allowed off leash into these dog parks.

The tests should demonstrate the off leash control owners have over their dogs while the dogs are faced with extreme distraction. In other words, the owners need to be able to call their dogs back away from a group of several dogs that are playing.

Dogs that can't pass these tests should not be allowed off leash in the parks.

These tests should include a knowledge of how to deal with dog fights.

There should be parks for small dogs and parks for large dogs.
Allowing very small dogs to run with large dogs can be a very dangerous situation for the small dog. The average pet owner has no idea how to break up a dog fight. They also can't comprehend how quickly a large dog can kill or seriously injure a small dog.

Be a responsible handler
There are some basic common sense rules that good owners should follow when they use a park.

When at the park and a dangerous or out of control dog shows up, leave the park. While you may feel you have the right to be there you gain nothing by pushing your limit and risking a dog fight.

Go to the park at off-peak hours. You will learn when the quiet times are, those are the times to be there with your dog. If you dress for the wind and rain there is nothing wrong with having the entire park to yourself.

When a dog pile or dog fight occurs, immediately call your dog away from the pack. There is nothing wrong with using a remote collar and practice calling your dog away from chasing a group of dogs.

There is nothing wrong with teaching your dog that you are more fun than other dogs at the dog park. When you go, play the games your dog loves away from the dog pack.

When your dog is off leash at the park, 100% of your of your focus should be on your dog.

If you wish to socialize with other dogs owners that fine, just do it when you have your dog on a leash.

Don't make the dog park it's only out of the home experience with you. Take it for walks, take it swimming (when possible) play or train in different locations. People who only take their dog to a dog park set themselves up for dogs to get out of control. The dogs with a lot of energy who only go to the dog park can take the attitude of USE IT OR LOSE IT which means they can get wild.

In my opinion people should learn how to use a remote collar. Collars are invisible leashes. They should study my low level stimulation training and understand when they can and cannot use a collar in a dog park. (Don't use a collar in the middle of a dog fight - the dog will think that his opponent is causing the stimulation and fight harder).

Notice the ball in the one dog's mouth -
allowing only one dog to have a toy will often trigger a dog attack.

News & Media Articles about Dog Parks

2 people, dog hurt in attack at dog park

The attack marked the first time since the Newport News Long Island park opened in April that a person was bitten, an official said.

March 30, 2007 NEWPORT NEWS -- A dog attack this week at the city's only off-leash park left a miniature dachshund with serious injuries and two women with bite wounds.

Christine Hyatt and her daughter, Kathy, were walking their three small dogs through Fido Field, an off-leash dog park at Riverview Farm Park, Tuesday when they heard someone holler.

Hyatt, 67, spun around and saw an Akita mix sink its teeth into the neck of her 2-year-old dachshund, Maddy, and start shaking.

Maddy broke free, but the dog attacked again.

Christine Hyatt and her daughter tried to intervene, and the Akita mangled Christine Hyatt's middle finger and bit her daughter's hand, Hyatt said.

Eventually, she said, the Akita's owner helped pull the dog off.

Hyatt's dog remained in an animal hospital Thursday, but a doctor said Maddy could be released this weekend, Hyatt said.

Hyatt, meanwhile, underwent treatment for her sliced and fractured finger at an emergency medical clinic.

She worried about the risk of rabies, since she didn't know whether the Akita had been vaccinated.

On Thursday, as she sat at the intersection of Menchville Road and Warwick Boulevard, Hyatt said, she saw the Akita's owner drive past.

It was "divine intervention," she said.

She and her daughter followed him to a Bryan Court home, where she confronted the driver, according to a city animal services report.

The driver, James Coleman, admitted owning the Akita, Hyatt said.

She's hoping Coleman will cover her dog's medical bills.

Coleman couldn't be reached for comment Thursday, but Bill Wise, the city's animal services superintendent, said Coleman reported his dog, "Kita," was registered and up-to-date on its shots.

The incident marked the first substantiated report of a person being bitten at the park since it opened in April 2006, said Andy Lunsford, the city's parks operations superintendent.

At Fido Field on Thursday, Josh Biskey, 27, watched his German shepherd, Dakota, roll through the dirt with a mixed terrier.

He described the park as a great place for both dog owners and dogs to socialize.

Most people, he said, recognize when their pets become aggressive.

"You have to step in before something happens," Biskey said. "You need to know what your dog's capable of."

Making Dog Parks Safer

A sixty-pound child is roughed up by a one-hundred pound dog at a place where dogs are supposed to run free, but run safely. Changes may soon be made at some area dog parks, after an incident this weekend raises questions about safety at the parks. A child was pawed and bitten by a dog at a Hamilton County dog park, and he's not alone.

Local 12 Reporter Jeff Hirsh unleashes some concerns in this developing story.

What's more fun than going to the park with your buddies, get some much-needed exercise, and even play wide retriever. Well, usually, it is fun, but not always.

"It was very scary."

These scratch and bite marks are on an eight year old boy who was at the Armleider Dog Park yesterday with his mom and their pet. But another dog ... a big mastiff ... perhaps only wanting to play ... used the child as a chew toy.

Tracy Hickenlooper, Dog bite victim's mother: "He was screaming, he rolled up into a ball, saying get him off me. He was rolling up into a ball, trying to get away, and the dog continued to go after him."

It's also a dog-eat-dog world. This dog needed stitches to close a wound several months ago, from the same Hamilton County Park Board facility.

"Now, if dogs could read the rules, they would find out that owners are supposed to have leashes in hands at all times, that big dogs and small dogs are supposed to be in separate areas, and that aggressive dogs are supposed to be removed immediately."

Dogs who bite people are supposed to be quarantined for ten days, if they're caught.

Harold Dates, SPCA Director: "You've got to observe how your dog is behaving. Is he truly getting exercise? Is he trying to take over the other dogs in the park. What is your dog doing?"

Tyler and Nico are not exactly threats. Owner Anne Huddleston loves to bring them here. But sometimes, Huddleston sees other folks drop off dogs and leave for hours.

Anne Huddleston, Dog Owner: "Here they come back from wherever they've been, pick their dog up. They just leave them here, do whatever business they have to do and that's very irresponsible."

One nearby community may have a solution. In Anderson Township, park users pay a small yearly fee, register their dogs, wear i-d tags, and incident report forms are at the gate. Tracy Hickenlooper would like to see Hamilton County's Dog Park do the same thing.

"Some people see it as a social situation and they're on their cell phones and talking to dog owners and not paying attention to their dogs. These things happen fast."

Jeff Hirsh, Local 12.

Attack reports are rare in dog parks, but the Anderson Park District did ban one aggressive dog from its facility. Hamilton County is considering a permit-and-fee system in a possible new dog park. That's on the west side of town. There are no plans for it in Armleader Park, on the east side.

Pet death shows dog park danger Rottweiler attacked, killed dachshund at Centennial

BY FELIX DOLIGOSA JR.,

Californian staff writer e-mail: fdoligosa@bakersfield.com | Sunday, Jul 8 2007 9:40 PM

Last Updated: Sunday, Jul 8 2007 9:43 PM Grr the brown dachshund was just getting used to being around other canines at dog parks. He stopped soiling the ground whenever he was approached by a dog and wasn't afraid to sniff another mutt. Grr became that scared little dog again on July 2 when a hulking Rottweiler cornered and attacked him in a central Bakersfield dog park. Despite getting kicked and punched in his face, the growling Rottweiler only stopped after it fatally punctured Grr's throat. The dachshund would die about 31/2 hours later, according to Animal Emergency and Urgent Care. "To some people dogs are just animals, but to us he was a child," said Grr's owner, Spencer Schluter. "Grr was just starting to come out of his shell." Taking a dog to any of Bakersfield's four dog parks can be a risk because you never know what kind of dogs you will encounter, said Kern County Animal Control Chief Denise Haynes. "It's tough because everybody should have a place to exercise their dog," Haynes said. "Each individual dog owner must not only think about the risks of other dogs, but also their own." Spencer and his wife, Sarah Schluter, went to the Centennial Dog Park at 400 Montclair St. that nice, warm evening to let Grr and his Chihuahua buddy, Furio, get some exercise. "We've been visiting this park for the past two weeks and all the other dogs have been very friendly," Spencer Schluter said. "We were thinking if a dog attacked, we could just scoop up Grr and Furio. The couple were walking in the park when an unleashed Rottweiler scrambled from 10 feet away to chase down Grr, Schluter said. The owner was in the middle of the park playing soccer, according to the couple. The Rottweiler cornered Grr against a fence and bit the dachshund several times, Schluter said. Schluter, who used to practice martial arts, punched and kicked the Rottweiler without getting him Pet death shows dog park danger - Latest news | Bakersfield.com - Kern...

http://www.bakersfield.com/hourly_news/story/183970.html 2 of 2 7/9/2007 7:50 AM to stop. The estimated 150-pound dog didn't stop until it was done. Schluter took off his shirt and wrapped it around Grr's neck as blood dripped over the owner's chest and legs. He cried, "help me, help me," as they carried Grr to their car and hurried to an animal hospital. Schluter gave Grr mouth-to-mouth resuscitation. Air bubbled out of holes in Grr's throat. "Please don't leave us, Grr. Please stay with us," the couple told the dog as they sped past red lights. Grr stopped crying after driving through several blocks as his tongue hung outside his mouth. The blood over Grr's face made his brown eyes look green. Grr, the dog the couple called their NutraSweet baby because he was their substitute child, died when a hemorrhage formed in his neck, according to the veterinarian hospital. "I pray he wasn't in pain," Spencer Schluter said. "Because of his neck injury, they couldn't give him an anesthetic." He and and wife bought Grr after they were married in 2005. "We planned to have him with us for most of our marriage," he said. "To see our children grow up, to be old and cranky with us, to never learn not to poop on the rug." With all that happened that sad night, the couple didn't think about finding the Rottweiler owner. Police searched the area and never found any suspects, said Lt. Mike Cantrell with the Bakersfield Police Department. "I don't want to sue the owner," Schluter said. "I don't want to abuse Grr's memory by focusing on anger, but we feel people should be aware of the danger of certain breeds of dog so that incidents like this don't happen. "If that had been one of the many children who play in that park, I don't want to think about the possible outcomes."

Dog Park violence on the rise

By Lisa Black

Published March 27, 2007,

Robin Hunt used to walk her pets up to three miles a day at a Libertyville dog park. But she hasn't since July, when two Akitas mauled her 12-pound Chihuahua mix, Deardra, and left her with $5,000 in veterinarian bills.

Deardra is among dozens of dogs bitten or attacked in the past year at the region's dog parks, according to data kept by various agencies. Some veterinarians and trainers worry that too few owners take responsibility for their pets in the free-for-all environment in which dogs frolic off-leash.

In response, some dog park operators are strengthening rules or creating "adjustment areas"—smaller spaces where dogs may get accustomed to socializing before entering the larger park. Among them is Lake in the Hills' Bark Park, where a pack of young dogs killed a Pomeranian last year.

Advocates who enumerate the benefits of exercise and socialization say the majority of dogs safely use parks.

But as dedicated dog parks proliferate in the Chicago area, others say the problem of dog attacks is just emerging. Even the most docile animals, they say, can raise another pup's hackles or skirmish over a toy.

"Dog parks are a great idea, but I honestly don't think there's enough control," said Cathie Sabin, owner of B.C. Dog Training in Mundelein. "I have seen people pull up to a dog park, open the gates, let the dogs in and go back in their car and read a newspaper."

Most dog parks require permits and proof that the animal is vaccinated. Sabin wonders if the permit holders should also be tested on whether their dog responds by name and if the owner can recognize menacing signs, such as a dog that assumes an aggressive stance.

Dr. Kristen Temo, a veterinarian who treated Deardra at the Animal Emergency and Treatment Center in Grayslake, said she often treats dogs for scrapes after they visit Libertyville's Independence Grove Dog Exercise Area. Temo rarely takes her 95-pound dog there.

"That's because I don't like sewing up cuts on my day off," she said.

When the Akitas cornered Deardra, the two women who brought them had walked around a bend, deep in conversation. Hunt said one of the Akitas had started "death shaking" Deardra by the time she was able to get the women's attention by screaming. Deardra underwent surgery to fix a gaping hole in her abdomen.

It is difficult to estimate the numbers of injuries at the parks because they are often lumped into broader categories of dog bites. It's likely that some aren't reported at all.

Chicago and Cook County officials declined to provide statistics but said they have received very few reports.

Lake County Animal Control Supervisor Len Hackl estimates that he receives 20 to 25 reports annually of dog-on-dog bites at the four dog parks owned by the Forest Preserve District.

“We just had a discussion with some of the forest preserve staff, because we found out there were incidents being reported to them and not to us and vice versa," Hackl said. "We are going to keep better track of that, especially with spring and summer coming."

The DuPage County Forest Preserve District recorded 26 dog-on-dog incidents at its seven offleash dog parks in 2006, spokesman Bill Weidner said.

In McHenry County, dog parks are overseen by municipalities, and no such statistics are available. But Bark Park in Lake in the Hills instituted new rules after the Pomeranian's death.

The park now prohibits dogs that are aggressive, in heat or younger than 6 months.

No statistics were available for the two dog parks operated by Will County's Forest Preserve District. The district has rescinded several permits because of aggressive dog behavior over six years, said spokesman Bruce Hodgdon.

He recalls easily the most serious incident, on the opening day of Hammel Woods, in which a small dog died.

Even the people who love dog parks and seldom have problems say they understand the need to tend to their animals.

"I've had maybe two incidents where I've come across an aggressive dog," said Selina

Carpenter of Grayslake, a regular at Independence Grove park. In one case, she said a yellow lab growled at her Great Dane, Hampton, when he tried to play with the lab's toy.

In most dog parks, regulars develop friendships and form a self-policing community, she said.

Authorities say regulars often report park violations.

Trainer Toriano Sanzone, owner of DOPA Dogs in Chicago, said he advises clients to run through training commands with their dogs at the parks and then reward them by letting them run off-leash.

"You shouldn't just let them go," said Sanzone, who said that too many owners talk on cell phones or socialize with others while their dogs play.

He likened it to parents ignoring preschoolers at a park.

"Eventually someone is going to fall off a slide or get into it over a particular swing," he said.

He advises owners to keep a short 4-inch leash on their dogs so they can restrain them if necessary. Other trainers suggest bringing an air horn to scare off an aggressive dog.

If there is a fight between dogs, experts say it will be difficult to step in without getting hurt.

Some advise pulling a dog's hind legs to get it away from another animal; others suggest wedging a large stick in the dog's mouth.

Maggie Ross, 25, of Lake Villa said she was terrified when a stocky white dog—she is not sure of the breed—latched onto the neck of her yellow Labrador retriever at Independence Grove last month. Her 9-month-old dog, Payton, wasn't injured badly because he was wearing a collar that became entangled in the attacker's teeth, she said.

"My dog was gasping for air. His eyes were bulging out," Ross said. "From the sounds of it, I thought my dog was dying."

The woman who owned the attacking dog was fined $300 and prohibited from returning to the park because there was a prior record of her two pets fighting, officials said.

"Dogs won't fight unless there's an issue," Sabin said. "But like people with their kids, it's never my kid [who started it]. It's never my dog." --

Tucson Wants Tougher Laws Against Irresponsible Pet Owners

Oct 3, 2007 12:30 PM PDT

Are Old Pueblo pups sitting pretty or are our dogs in danger? It depends who you ask.

click here to access an interactive web story put out by Men's Health Magazine that reveals the nations top dog friendly cities. By clicking on Tucson you can see we get the fourth ranking for a number of reasons. The best marks come from our vet services. From this you'd think our pooches are in primo shape, right? Think again!

City council is looking at the quality of life for our four legged friends.

Dog parks are some of the only places in the city where your dog can roam leash-free, but the city is pushing for tougher punishment for dog owners who break that law.

Dog parks are a growing trend across the country and Tucson is no different.

"He loves it here, he has a great time so it's great that it's really convenient," says Crystal Adams.

There's nothing more enjoyable for Crystal and her little dog Rusty than leaving the leash at home. But it's outside the dog park where she has concerns about other dogs roaming free.

"Having irresponsible pet owners without the dogs on a leash and they're aggressive, that's not too great," says Crystal.

That's why Tucson City Councilwoman Carol West is pushing for tougher laws against violators after a string of disturbing incidents in her ward. One particularly gruesome story where a loose dog became dangerous.

"A little puppy was on a leash in a park and a big dog came and tore his eye out."

West says increasing fines by $50 could discourage pet owners from letting their dogs run loose. Violators would pay up to 200 dollars. …

Reviews
Q&A

May 5, 2012

I've had dogs all my life, but had never been to a dog park. I never heard of them until recently, they seem to be the in thing. After going a few years since the passing of my last dog, we got a puppy from the local shelter. She's a great pet and I'm doing everything I can to understand the subtleties of the pack structure. Since there is a dog park a couple of miles away, I wanted to look into the idea of going to it with our now 4 month old mix. Frankly, the idea of a dog park never made sense to me. My father always taught me to avoid other dogs when walking our dogs growing up. So I went online to learn what I could about them. I didn't want my dog to miss out on something like a trip to a dog park if it's so great.

I am so glad you wrote your article about dog parks! It is a public service for those of us who are interested in doing what's best for our dogs, but don't have the training and experience of some one like you. More than anything, it is a service to dogs. Your article slapped some sense into me before I made the mistake of subjecting my dog to the risks of the dog park.

Again, than you for posting your article on dog parks for people like me to find. Our dog Rubia is fortunate that people like you take the time and effort to protect their best interests!

Fred

March 3, 2012

Hi,

I know you guys have a pretty strong opinion about people taking their dogs to dog parks. I thought I would share this story with you as a good example as to why you should never take a dog to a dog park.

http://fox13now.com/2012/03/03/two-dogs-hospitalized-after-incident-in-dog-park/

Amanda

Hi,

This is in regards to dog parks. I took my dog to a park when I think she was 6 months to a year old. I had taken her there all the time with few problems. But there was a dog that was knowingly aggressive. It was an Irish Wolfhound and it wore a metal face mask. The dog attacked my dog and used it as a battering ram on her. The owner did nothing but stood there and watched. Trying to get my dog I was bit, and other people came running over to help. After this happened the owner of the dog said nothing to me and just continued to walk her dog. I spoke to several other owners who had the same experience with this dog and owner. I reported her to animal control and parks and services and they would do nothing except to say you enter at your own risk. And they had to be there to see it happening. I never took my dog back there and never took her back to a park again. Her personality was forever changed the day that dog attacked her. I wish I had never taken her to a dog park.

Hi,

I just wanted to say that finding the leerburg site at 2 am on my last nightshift at work has changed my life. No really. I have two 22 month old female litter sister miniature bullterriers and then (ignorantly) added a third, now 9 months. The litter sisters fought as early as four months old. Not long ago they fought again and I was alone and had no idea how to break it up. In the end there was blood and pieces of flesh and I was just so traumatized. In reality it took the girls to fight and hurt themselves so badly for me to finally search for a qualified answer. Nearly every single thing that Ed wrote about has happened to me - the fighting, the ranking issues and about the power of the a pack of three dogs.

The best article, on dog parks (where my girls were attacked at a young age) made me feel so relieved. I will never go back. I had no idea I was supposed to protect them. I ordered the dominant and aggressive dog dvd straight away. I watched it and slipped from the couch to the floor. Finally I wiped away all the tears and got up - I re-erected their crates and separated the girls. I watched more videos. I walked them separately and took one day at a time. They are not allowed in my bedroom at all and I am trying to establish myself as the leader in their lives. I am a psychotherapist and have learnt to understand why and how people act and react the way they do and it never once occurred to me to investigate the language of dogs. I felt so ashamed.

The girls are doing well and the most most amazing thing is that now that they are crated and I don't have potential chaos on my hands at any one moment - life has become so much more manageable. They love their crates and I am hoping that one day they might be able to supervised together for short periods of time again. I don't know yet if that day will come. I am learning as much as I can all the time and hopefully they will respect me one day soon.

Thank you for your clear articulated truthful answers and qualified experienced based knowledge that has helped my girls and myself come to terms with reality and hopefully a more structured and safer future.

My boyfriend and I took our Jack Russell/Pug to the dog park where he was in the pen with about eight other dogs and they were all doing fine. A large Pitt-bull/Terrier mix came into the pen with his owner and three children. It happened so fast--the attack, that my dog would have been killed if Chris, (my boyfriend) did not intervene. I know that Chris almost lost his thumb while saving my dog, but my dog, Tucker, would have surely been dead if he hadn't. I think Chris was extremely lucky that he didn't lose his thumb or experience much more serious injuries as once the jaws lock it's impossible to get them open. I'm not sure why the dog let go but Chris pulled our dog, Tucker up off the ground by his harness and that's when he got bitten. The dog was trying to latch on to our dog again after Chris got him off the ground. I was reading your advice on the web about breaking up dog fights and in retrospect it all makes sense. However, what doesn't make sense is going to a dog park in the first place because you never know what type of dog you'll encounter. That was surely Tucker's last trip to a dog park and ours as well!!!

Below is a picture of our little dog, Tucker (22 lbs.) who was prey to the larger aggressor who had to weigh about 130 lbs. Big dogs and little dogs don't mix...

Best,
Kaydi

Let me know if you need to know anything else. As of now we aren't sure about the prognosis of Chris's thumb--nerve, tissue, ligament damage etc. as it just happened yesterday. They gave him about 8 stitches but now we are learning that you aren't supposed to stitch dog bites. However, since this went down to the bone--they had no choice.

Ed -

Just wanted to write and say, "Thank you!" for your web site. I adopted a male GSD about a year ago and am consistently faced with changing behavioral issues. I am doing a thorough read and search of your site to assist me in resolving MY issues. I hope I never end up on one of your stupid questions lists! Although, I find them very entertaining.

I have had HORRIBLE experiences at the local dog park, and have since quit going. So, I found the article about dog parks particularly funny. I even had a fight with my city because they would not allow me to have my dog on a leash in the park. They ARE THE DUMBEST DOG PEOPLE EVER! By the way two dogs to date have been KILLED at my local dog park (these are the ones I am aware of at least!)

I don't have a question today, just wanted to give you thanks and praise. I am hoping to be able to locate the answers to my questions on your web site - but, due to the wealth of information, it is taking some time to wade through it all.

Thank You,
Julie
Plano, TX

Dear Ed,

I just wanted to send an email and thank you for the advice you gave me some weeks ago in regards to our dog and his trainer. I also wanted to thank you for your wonderful articles on why as dog owners we should avoid dog parks.

I live in Las Vegas where dog parks are very popular. I refuse to allow my six month old Cane Corso into the parks despite my friends telling me I'm depriving him of socialization. The dog parks here are divided into two halves for small and large dogs but I've seen nasty fights breaks out on both sides (I walk my dog on his leash in the surrounding park area). Last week a Yorkie was killed by a Chow after his dumb owner brought him to the large dog side, proceeded to put him down and talked on her cell phone. A few nights ago a pit and an Akita got into a fight and it was absolutely horrific watching these owners try to break up two strong willed dogs in survival mode. Your comments on your site are dead on, these parks are filled with owners who use the time to socialize amongst themselves, paying little to no attention to what their dogs are doing. As I walk my dog I see how most of them have no control over their animals, they tell the dog to come, it ignores them etc. The point you make which really hit home to me is that we can never assume other dogs have been well trained or well socialized just because our dog is. In addition I've also seen parents allow small toddler children to run wild in the park, thinking it's cute when the dogs chase them and allowing their children to manhandle strange dogs without asking the owner's permission. After seeing all this I'm so glad I heeded your advice about these "accidents waiting to happen" dog parks. I'm going to focus my energies on my dog's training and ignore my friend's comments.

A Grateful Reader,
Kristen

I've seen a few fights, but none resulted in serious injuries as most owners have enough sense to call their dogs to them when a scuffle breaks out. I did witness a few owners and their dogs get banned from the park due to sheer idiocy. One woman (she fit the stereotype for "redneck trailer trash" to a T) brought with her a very dominant, poorly trained un-neutered pit bull mix. At the time the park had about 15-20 dogs running around, mostly Boxers and Golden Retrievers (for some strange reason. about 8 Boxers.). This woman had taken the collar off of her dog instead of just unsnapping the leash and had wandered off to the opposite end of the park to talk to this group of people. Her dog was terrorizing smaller dogs and chasing them, nipping at them, and becoming a nuisance by challenging any other dog at the park. It wasn't until the dog began harassing a Boxer puppy (between 5-7 months old) that anyone really stepped in to stop this dog. It had begun chasing the puppy, who was obviously distressed and began yelping, which only egged the pit mix on. The pit was nipping at this puppy's back legs, knocking him over, and trying to tug at the skin of the dog's neck. The Boxer's owner was able to grab his dog, hoist the yelping puppy over his shoulder, and it still wasn't enough to deter this pit mix. The pit began LEAPING at this man's shoulder and chest, eyes locked on the guy's puppy, and each time the man would scream and kick the dog off it would just run and take another flying leap at the man's dog. This guy was a good 6-foot something and with the Boxer over his shoulder he still managed to keep his pup safe, but by this time SEVERAL owners were trying to shoo the pit mix away and grab a hold of it to control it, the entire time screaming "Whose dog is this? Get your dog off of me, call your dog, someone get this dog out of here!" After about 2 minutes of this dog leaping and biting at the puppy/owner the redneck woman walked over to the commotion and tried to call her dog over, which of course was almost useless. By the time she caught the dog she had to be straddling it and holding its neck since she couldn't manage to get it's collar on correctly, and finally the dog park owner was able to edge through everyone and humiliate her in front of the crowd. He told her that she was not welcome back at he park again and that she was irresponsible for bringing her obviously aggressive dog in, which park rules forbid, and went on about the lack of control she had over the dog and the fact that she wasn't even supervising the dog because she was across the park. All I heard her say was something about, "He's never done that before! He just wanted to play with the puppy! He's not mean, you're being unreasonable my dog wouldn't do that." As she was walking out the other owners were cheering and laughing, I was quite amused. Thankfully for me, at the time I had taken my old dog Shadow and she was sitting by my side in the back of the park the entire time this occurred.

Aside from that one distinct incident, most fights are due to stupid owners bringing their small dogs into the big dog section of the park (JRTs, toy poodles, Fox terriers, Dashounds, etc) and then arguing with big dog owners when their dogs are chased into their arms, yelping and screaming, because the larger dogs would terrorize them (or just try to sniff and greet, which often was enough to frighten the tiny dog). The argument usually ends with the small dog owner leaving because they didn't agree with using the small dog park area since "there aren't as many dogs in there for my dog to play with."

I'm fairly grateful that I'm able to go at times where there might be one or two other dogs, but the amount of idiots that come to the park is astounding. So many unaltered animals run around and many times people bring their pets that have lived in their back yard and with their family for years without ever socializing with other animals, so these people assume their dog is totally fine since it loves people and it might get along with, say, their in-law's Labrador or something. These are often the ones that wonder why their dog is biting at all the other dogs or sitting behind their legs growling at anything that approaches. I've even had some odd instances where I'd be taking photos somewhere in the park and I've had dogs stand about 5 or 10 feet from me and just bark. I assume they don't like my camera, as it can be a bit noisy, but I don't always feel very safe. I once was sitting at a picnic bench and this woman's Great Dane walked about 15 feet from my seat and stared at me for about 5 minutes. I kept taking shots until the dog began barking furiously, which surprised me into nearly falling out of my seat since I hadn't been paying attention. The owners kept calling their dog back but this thing would not stop walking near my bench, staring at me, growling, and barking. Needless to say, I beat a hasty retreat along the perimeter of the fence and left before that dog decided I was more of a threat than it felt at that moment. I love big dogs, I adore Danes, but this dog was NOT happy with my presence.

I know you don't take your dogs to those parks, but have you heard of any local instances of dog fights at one of them?

Jinn / Sabarika

Mr. Frawley

I ran into another example of how ignorant most people are about proper care and training of dogs today. One of coworkers adopted a 10 month old golden retriever mix last week. In talking with him today he commented that he'd been taking it to the local dog park already. I told him I'd never take my Malamute mix there, as all it would take was one aggressive dog and the fur would fly. He then told me that yeah, he'd already seen a couple dog fights there, but he didn't worry about his dog, as it was "put in his place" by a larger dog last weekend. I quickly explained to him that it doesn't work that way, and being attacked would be more likely to make his new pet dog aggressive. I then sent him a copy of your article on Dog Parks. I've had the same issue with another coworker, who unfortunately ignored your advice and still takes his year old great dane to the park. The dog park in question is about the worst situation I can imagine. It's simply a 1/4 acre field with a 4' fence around it. No supervision outside of the dogs owners themselves. To make matters worse one local dog trainer was interviewed by the paper and stated that it was a wonderful thing as the dogs would be able to play and learn proper pack behavior. I saw that and thought, Yeah, they'll learn that little dogs get beat up by packs of big dogs.

You may recall that I e-mailed you last year after my dog had been repeatedly attacked while on our evening walks. At that point I'd already pepper sprayed 2 different aggressor dogs. Since then I've given up on walking my dog in this neighborhood and just exercise her as best I can at home. Re-reading your article on dog parks today it dawned on me that I'm living in one! Most of my neighbors have dogs that they let roam completely unsupervised. Several more walk their obviously untrained dogs off leash, where they run every which way through every unfenced yard. The dogs range from toy poodles to Rottweilers. Fortunately between my dog and my next door neighbors' 2 German Shepherds (who are always restrained) the other dogs stay out of our yards. Now that the ground has thawed here, my yard will soon have a large fenced area where I can safely train and exercise my dog. The worst part is that I now have to deal with the fact that my dog will snap at any strange dog that approaches unrestrained (we're working on that and it's rarely a problem now).

I also e-mailed previously about sled dogs, and how teams of up to 20 dogs can get along without constant fights over rank. I think I can answer that myself now after reading your articles and observing how mushers, at least the conscientious ones, handle their teams. First, any time a pair of dogs do fight, the mushers come down on them like a ton of bricks, clearly establishing themselves as the team's Alpha (the lead dog is clearly the second rank). Second, the dogs are normally restrained on chains out of reach, but in plain site of each other in a common fenced enclosure. The fence is to protect the dogs from moose and wandering dogs, and to keep in any dog that does manage to get loose. I believe that the dogs manage to establish pack rank without fighting or coming into direct contact through posturing and verbal signals. Two things provide evidence of this. One, many mushers I know, and even the local dog shelter, turn all their dogs loose inside the fence to run and play together briefly each day. As you can imagine, having up to 20 large dogs running together can be pretty chaotic. But fights are still very rare. One musher I know has his dogs so well trained that he can harness them, then turn them loose and they'll immediately run to their place on the main line and wait to be hitched to the sled. The other evidence I have that dogs establish pack order without fighting is my own dog, and the 2 German shepherds next door. The GSD's act very aggressive towards any dog they see go by. However, a couple times when one or the other of them has gotten loose and run up to me and my dog everyone is perfectly friendly. They can see my dog, and my dog can see them all the time. As I've stated before, my dog generally will snap at another dog that runs up to her unrestrained, so I have to assume that the 3 of them have established their pack order without any physical contact.

Thanks again for all your great advice, videos and articles! I don't know how I would have managed my dog without them.

Phil

I just wanted to take a moment to thank you for your web site advice. My beloved, very friendly dog was attacked in a park this past weekend. I was so upset with the owners of the dog, because their dog was so aggressive and yet not leashed. ( I am sure this dog has had "run -in's" in the past) Oddly enough, the owner was bit and my dog was left unharmed as your advice mentioned.

I told so many people of my ordeal and yet nobody seemed to know what they would have done either. Thank you so much for the proper advice.

My husband & I live in nearby West Bend, and are glad to know you are so close if we need your expertise.

Sincerely,
Michelle

I refuse to take my dogs to any dog park and your article pretty much hit all the reasons why I don't.

But since humans are social animals, one of the biggest problems I've seen has its roots in a well-established group of owners who meet at the same time. I have likened these groups as junior high school cliques. These cliques are aware that some of the dogs present will cow or attack a new dog at the park and they allow this to happen. If the owner of the new dog should protect their pet in any way, shape or form, they threaten the new person. Humans are predators as well and I've seen them pack up on new people (or myself when I got upset when my elderly golden was attacked).

My vet, when we were discussing the bad dynamics of dog parks social structure and safety, mentioned that there are people who know their dog is aggressive and enjoy bringing their dog to designated dog parks to see them attack other dogs. I've seen owners of large, powerful, protection dogs (young men with GSDs are the worst, followed by young men with Dobermans and Rottweilers) actually introduce their dog to the largest protection dog they encounter and try to initiate or prolong a fight. When their dogs attack mine, I tell them to get their dog off of mine. I have had been threatened with physical violence. I tell them I have pepper spray (and not just one of those lipstick canisters, but a size for more than a few really good shots to use on the problem dog AND their owner) that I will use on them as well as their dog.

My present golden retriever when she only weighed 35-40 pounds was attacked by a GSD (9 months old & 95 pounds). The dog was trying to grab her by the nape of the neck to shake her like a squirrel - the owners told me he was just a puppy and playing. My dog was screaming in fear and I kept on trying to get on top of her using my entire body as this dog was relentless. In trying to get my dog under my torso it bit my shoulder, arm, and elbow. Nobody helped me at all. Finally I shouted (and used very crude swear words) that if that dog was not controlled immediately I would do it myself. And this is the typical escalation of conflict at these dog parks. (BTW, my golden is fearful of strange dogs now - so I take her trail running and avoid other people and their dogs - she is much happier getting the exercise and chasing squirrels than the nonsense of a dog park). I started swearing at the people who told me their dog was just playing and the dogs should work it out. I told them that they are not going to work it out on my dog and that I would get their license plate numbers if my dog should be injured because I will sue. I've was told to leave this public dog park or that "they would make me." These idiots don't seem to realize that even making threats is simple assault, and when I tell them I will call the police for these threats they look stunned - apparently it doesn't occur to them that they are breaking the law.

My perspective of dog parks is very negative. I've seen people standing around in conversation and not monitoring the activity of their dogs. I've seen dog walkers bring up to 10-12 dogs over which they have no control. I've seen truly clueless people who may or may not have a dog come to the park with children as young as 3-4 years and allow their kids to commingle with a swirling mass of dogs.

Thank you for your frankness. I really appreciate someone who understands pack behavior and clearly states what is really going on with owners and their dogs.

Debbie

Hi Ed,

I enjoyed reading your article on dog parks. I used to take our Lab quite a bit, but not after an episode 2 weeks ago while vacationing in California. We have a 9 year old Lab, that just loves to play with other dogs.

We decided to go with friends to a dog park and low and behold 2 brothers, Akita's I might add were there. I didn't know what Akitas looked like or what the breeds disposition was prior to this episode.

We let our dog in the park and 2 Akitas came right up sandwiched our dog side to side;- One was head to head the other Head to rear at our dog. We heard a lot of growling and noticed the dogs were ready to go to war on ours. We heard ours yelp ( You could tell our dog knew he was in trouble) , my husband intervened ( THANK GOD) before the attack began.

However our dog must have had a panic or had anxiety attack, he fell to the ground and became uncoordinated just kicking( I thought he was having a seizure or heart attack) After 30 seconds he was fine. Ready to get up and play again. We left that park ASAP! Not to mention- haven't been to one since.

I can tell you, we will never go to another dog park EVER!

I have taken him to day care while I worked to play with other dogs, we have friends over that bring their dogs. He is very well socialized. However when I witnessed how quickly our dog could have been seriously injured or killed for that matter, I can't begin to tell you how upset I was. Worse yet the owners didn't even pull their dogs out of the area. All the other people left because the Akitas remained aggressive.

So I Thank you for warning people about these places. We were very lucky nothing happened to our dog that day, some people I'm sure aren't so lucky.

Take Care,
Lisa
Knoxville, Tn

Question on Dog Parks

Mr. Frawley,

Please help, I am desperate. Three months ago, we found Eli in the park. The vet believes he is about one year old. He is aggressive towards other dogs and chews everything that can fit into his mouth. Last night, in training class, Eli bit another dog and would not let go. The dog received stitches and my husband received a nice wound as well. On walks Eli is aggressive towards other dogs and try's to go after them. We have a lab collie mix who is 6 years old and much smaller. I want to begin a family soon. I am worried, can this behavior be stopped? Is it too aggressive. The trainer did not give any suggestions and I don't know what to do. I don't want Eli to hurt our other dog much less anyone else.

Thank you for your time.
Angelle

Answer on Dog Parks:

Read the articles on my web site about Dealing with Aggressive Dogs. Also read the Q&A sections. This can be cured with proper obedience training. I would recommend that you get a prong collar and my Basic Dog Obedience video.

Correcting this is going to require strong training with very severe corrections, the dog must respect the pack leader and fear the results of not minding more than its interest in fighting.

The reason your dog is aggressive is because it was a stray and had been attacked itself as a stray.

Some people do not have the temperament to correct hard enough to stop this behavior - those people need to find a new home for their dog.

Question on Dog Parks:

Hello,

I was exploring your sight and I had a question; I am the owner of a 4.5 month old Australian Shepherd/ lab mix. My trainer suggested that I socialize him to as many people and other animals as I am able. When I first adopted Jake, I found him difficult to manage. He was teething badly, and tended to nip at me in a somewhat aggressive manner. Jake has a very dominate personality. He is very confident, does not startle easily (at all!), and he is very alert. The first few weeks of ownership felt like a constant battle to gain leadership, and he often outsmarted me. I have been taking Jake to a local dog park several times a week for the last three weeks. He is very friendly with all the dogs and the humans as well. At the park he often wrestles with the adult dogs. One on particular dog try's and get Jake into the submissive posture. Unless he is tired, Jake energetically resists. These wrestling matches are not accompanied by growling or barking and the dogs will often stop, share a drink at the same water fountain and then start up again. I often intervene and have Jake sit for a while and rest, as he has a tendency of playing himself to exhaustion. Also, I have also noticed that Jake adjusts his play style to match the dog that he is playing with. If the other dog doesn't want to wrestle, they will play chase, or fetch together. I have seem him wrestle down a dog three his size, and then turn around and gently nuzzle a poodle half his size.

If I understood you correctly, you stated that dog parks may be detrimental to the bond between owner and companion. My experience has been just the opposite. Jake is much calmer, more affectionate and responsive to me. He seems more "in tune" with me, and he looks forward to his trips to the park so much so that he runs to the car almost every time I let him out in the yard. I was interested in your opinion on this. Am I inadvertently harming my dog? And how can this be when all the changes I have seen are positive ones?

I thank you for your time, and I hope to hear back from you soon.

Mary

Answer on Dog Parks:

You totally misunderstood what I wrote in my article on DOG PARKS. I never said or even implied that taking a dog to the dog park would hurt the relationship with the dog and handler. What you risk every single time that you take your dog there is that your dog will be attacked by a dog aggressive dog. If that happens you will have a dog fighter for the rest of your life.

Read my article on animal aggression.

You would be much wiser to spend the same amount of time training your dog in obedience. The one on one time spent in training will have far better results than the time your dog spends wrestling with other dogs. If you want exercise – take your dog swimming, play Frisbee,ball with him. Time spent with the owner is 59 times better than time spent with other dogs.

If you would like to learn more about the principles of obedience training a dog, read the description for my Basic Dog Obedience video. You will probably find that you have not had the full picture on the steps of training a dog must go through before it can be considered fully trained. You can also read why I am not a fan of taking an untrained dog to obedience classes.

Get a prong collar and train your dog. If you were working with a dog trainer that knew what he or she was talking about they would have already told you these things.

Dog park fight

Testimonial on Dog Parks:

Mr. Frawley,

I have been reading some of your articles with great interest, especially ones that talk about dogs and their pack instincts. While reading your article about dog parks something came to my mind that I wanted to ask your advice on.

Where I live we have plenty of dogs and businesses that cater to their needs. I think that responsible dog walkers provide a wonderful service and can be a great asset to some of the dog owners. I do however have a huge problem with pack walkers. These people are super irresponsible and I don't think they even realize the sort of dangers that can be associated with what they do. I am talking about dog walkers who are trying to maximize their profits and will walk as many as 15 dogs at once!!! (yes, that's one person walking all these dogs together and I am not talking about chihuahuas!).

I have seen them on city streets and in parks. The dogs they walk are in danger of injury, any other dogs or people they meet are in danger, not to mention these people never pick up the piles of poop their dog herds drop as they walk.

I want to write a letter to the city news paper with hopes that something will be done about this. I'm not hoping for any sort of legislation, but at least by educating the public and consumers this sort of practice will cease.

I am writing to you with the hopes that you would be so kind as to help me to write such an article or point me towards articles describing similar scenarios. I am not knowledgeable enough about the dynamics of a pack of dogs to be able to write a powerful enough article on this topic. I can write about some of the other nuisances and risks associated with pack walking.

How many dogs do you think is the most one person should be in charge of? Our city by-law limits the number of dogs per house hold to 3. I thought this might be a reasonable number of dogs for a dog walker to be in charge of as well.

I would really appreciate any sort of suggestions or help you may be able to offer me.

Looking forward to your reply,
Marta

Testimonial on Dog Parks:

I took my 2 year old Great Dane to the dog park a few days ago. Same park we've been going to for the past year, no problems. Well, a un-neutered male dog came up to him and started growling at him. I forget the breed, but something like a Chiva, Silva, something. Little brown dog, seventy pounds or so. Well, my Dane obviously felt provoked and growled back. Duh! Fight ensued, the other dog ended up with three puncture wounds. One 1 1/2" deep, and so I encouraged the owner to take their dog to the vet. They resisted at first, but I insisted. I spoke with the owner and gave her my information to pay their entire bill, as my Dane had never bitten another dog (or anything for that matter) ever before.

A day later I got a call from her husband, irate as all get-go. I finally calmed him down and explained that I did everything in my power to break up the fight (yes, I know how to pull them apart from behind) but they ran off. I am sure they reported me anyway, because I got a nasty-gram from the city today, and so I decided to research my liabilities. Well, after reading various articles and opinions, many on your site, I've decided it's smarter to keep my puppies at home, safe, and away from the un-neutered male dogs of the world. Poco has been attacked 5 times now, and I realize what you say is true - he's learning to be a fighter. I don't want that!

When I send them the money for the bill, I am also going to send them a link to your web site so maybe they can realize the same thing I have. Dog parks are NOT safe.

Thanks for waking me up and helping me (hopefully) avoid future problems.

Testimonial on Dog Parks:

I recently took my six-month old Jack Russell Terrier to an unleash dog park here in Southern California. Unfortunately the dog park is self-governed and has only been divided into large and small dogs with no posted regulations. My dog had been there numerous times without incident, but the other day she went to investigate a very small older T-cup Chihuahua who bit her on the nose. My dog was trying to establish the pack order when the owner jerked her dog away from mine, but she was still attached. The small dog only weighed 3 1/2 pounds and was seven years old. The dog passed away five days later. As a pet owner I felt horrible and I went immediately to the emergency pet hospital and told them I would be happy to pay for half the bill.

All this has not been enough I am now being sued, and told they are going to have a motion to order that my little dog be put down since she is aggressive.

Since that time I have read several articles on the definition of inter-dog aggression and all three exclude example of aggression when the dog is provoked, such as being bitten first.

Question on Dog Parks:

Over the weekend a dog was killed by two pit bulls at a local dog park. I had coincidentally seen these two pit bulls at a dog park near my home which I had gone to "check out" ( I personally have never taken my dogs to a dog park after my Doberman was attacked and almost died 7 years ago) only a few days before the killing.

I have spent the last several days at this park warning other dog owners of these two dogs in particular and other general precautions they should adhere to should they choose to be in a dog park. The stuff I have heard and seen has frightened me to the core of my being. People with toddlers loose among a group of dogs, misinterpretation of dog behavior, obvious bullying and dominating labeled "oh he just wants to play", rapid escalation of other dogs joining a dominating dog ....people are not educated on what is appropriate behavior. I have been scouring the internet to compile any type of informational material that I can gather to educate these dog owners about

1) when is my dog being bullied ?
2) when is my dog being a bully?
3) what are acceptable behaviors and what is going to lead to trouble?

Can you direct me to any material in particular that would help? I would like to be able to arm people with knowledge: signs they should look for and dispel some of the myths...

Thanks!

Ed's Comment on Dog Parks:

The solution is to not visit dog parks. Dogs are pack animals - there is NO REAson on earth to be exposing your dog to strange dogs outside of his pack. You bring problems on yourself by doing this. Not only is this concept of dog parks dangerous for your dog - it is dangerous for people who find themselves in a position to have to break up dog fights.

Read the article I wrote on HOW TO BREAK UP A DOG FIGHT WITHOUT GETTING HURT.

Hi-
Your site is great and I am looking for your opinion about by 14 month old dog Maisie. She is a Australian Shepherd mix (picture @ 8 mos. attached). We got her at a pet adoption day when she was 8 mos. old. She was spayed. Her previous owner was a college student who couldn't care for the dog.

The dog quickly adjusted to living with us and has been nothing but affectionate (very) to me and my wife.

After a few months went by, she began barking at people approaching the house, which was OK with me at that time. I didn't reward or punish. Since I travel, I thought it would be nice to have the dog make some noise if a stranger approaches the house while my wife is home alone. However, this problem is getting out of hand. She now is going crazy when the doorbell rings and will not calm down. We have put her in her crate and she makes so much noise, that we have to move her to a back room when guests are here.

We want to get her used to guests, so a little after guests arrive, we will bring her out on a leash to sniff the guests and get to know them. Both times we did that, she jumped at the guests (I yanked her back on the leash and yelled at her) and she was removed to the back room for the remainder of the visit. This behavior was once limited to our house, but now she is beginning to do similar things outside of the house.

We have always taken her to dog parks to play with other dogs and people and her behavior there has generally been good. If she has ever gotten into a scuffle, I have pulled her away reprimanded her and forcefully walked her away on her leash. THe last two times at the dog park, she aggressively attacked small white dogs (unprovoked). Both times, I have verbally reprimanded her and shaken her on her leash. Since, it happened a second time, I doubt it is having an effect.

Lastly, she has begun to growl and lunge at people outside of our home (in the pet store and on a farm where I work). I never let her go unleashed outside of the dog park or our backyard for fear that she will attack a dog or a person.

Can this problem be treated or is it too late? I feel that this problem is new. She has basic obedience training, and will follow basic commands but does not pay attention in high distraction situations.

Your advice would be appreciated.

Brian
Florida

Dog Fights in Dog Parks

I have a 5 year old female pit mix. She is very loveable and friendly-especially to people. Everyone that comes into contact with her says that she is just the sweetest dog. Very affectionate.

About a week ago, we went to the dog park that we always go to. There were the usual 5 dogs that go there that she runs around with-but there was one dog that I haven't seen there before. She was running around with them having a blast. Then all of a sudden, a fight broke out between my dog and the other dog-who is not aggressive at all. It sounded terrible. I didn't know what to do-so I stood clear to let them fight-didn't want to get in the middle. My dog was very aggressive-she kept going after the other dog. The owner of the other dog tried to break it up and got badly bit. The two dogs eventually were separated and I left as soon as I can. Ever since the fight-my dog has been acting funny. Very timid, and scared, which is very unlike her. She's usually very happy.

I have a few concerns:

-Why is my dog acting weird, should I be worried about my own safety-she's never tried to attack me.

-Since the owner of the other dog got bit-can he do anything to me-legally?

I just don't know where to go from here. I definitely will not go to that park, or any other park. She will be on a leash at all times. Any advise would be greatly appreciated.

Thank you very much,
Sarah Q.

I'd also like to say, upon re-reading your article, that I do appreciate it. I enjoy going to my local dog park because I am friends with several trainers and owners that frequent it (whose dogs are very well under their control) but each time I go I bring a first-aid kit for my dog. I go less and less frequently any more because I'm seeing more and more un-neutered and un-spayed dogs running around, especially those who are mixes of dog-aggressive prone breeds. I have absolutely no problems with such breeds, but it worries me because of certain incidents I have witnessed. One such incident was a very large un-neutered adult "pit bull" mix type dog--looked to be an Am Staff cross. There were perhaps 6 to 8 Boxers in the park that day with two being pups looking about 4 to 6 months. This pit-type dog became very dominant with one of the smaller puppies and began to rough it up by knocking it over and chasing it. Several owners noticed this behavior becoming quite dangerous and leading to aggression so the Boxer pup's owner (a man of about 6') took his pup and began to walk away. Nobody could locate the pit's owner since they were nowhere in immediate sight. I watched (and I'm upset I didn't take photos of this) as the pit turned around and continued after the Boxer as it was being led by the harness with it's owner. The owner finally picked the pup up (after it began yelping and further provoking this pit's nips and excited barks) and the pit didn't stop there--it began to leap (several feet off the ground) and snap at the pup as the man carried it. The aggression ensued as owners began congregating to find a way to keep this dog away because it had no collars on whatsoever and was wriggling past everyone to take giant running leaps at the Boxer--who was now hoisted over the man's shoulder. The man was physically pushing and shoving this aggressive dog away from him because it was jumping about as high as his chest and laughing itself off of other dogs and people to get to the Boxer puppy. The owner was finally located (she was quite unfit to be an owner--very skinny white trash-type woman with an attitude and obviously very little dog education) and was yelled at by several owners to keep an eye on her dog and to keep an obviously dog-aggressive animal out of the park. The dog obviously didn't listen to her because it took several minutes to be caught and she put a chain collar on it, the entire time babbling about how her dog "just wants to play" and "isn't mean at all." The owner of the dog park had arrived at this time and demanded that she leave the park and was not welcome back, as far as I had heard this was not an isolated incident involving her and her dog. Since then I've been very cautious about when I bring my dog in (~9 month-old husky/aussie cross) and how long I stay. It proves the point that dog parks are not safe for many reasons and it's almost like playing roulette with your pup--you don't know what dog is going to trigger an attack and it's go at your own risk.

Jinn

Dog Park
Photo by Jinn Sabarika ~ www.spiralingdreams.com

Problems in Dog Park:

Ed,

I am the owner of an dobie with a very even temprement...but when provoked he will fight back. We go to a dog park and he plays and walks with other dogs. This week a neutered Cane Corso after walking with him decided to hump him once we were done with the walk. The owner did nothing to pull his dog off of my dog. My dog freaked out and they got in a fight, no blood was shed, but the owner of the dog that did the humping started a big uproar and emailing members that he considered my dog a dangerous dog (Dobe) and pulled people on his bandwagon. I think people should control their dogs so that they are not humping other dogs at the park. Others say that is normal behavior. I cannot seem to convince half of the people that it is inappropriate park behavior. What do you think? Is the dobe a dangerous dog for protecting himself? Is the Cane Corso the start of the fight because of the humping behavior? Thank you.

Karin

Ed's Answer to Problem in Dog Parks

This is an example of why you should not be going to Dog Parks. They are a bad idea conceived by nice people.

The fact that the Dobe acted appropriately is beside the fact. What should have happened was the owner of the Can should have stopped this behavior, when that did not happen the Dobe owner should have stopped the behavior. Neither of these things happened so the Dobe had to deal with it.

People who do not understand pack behavior go to dog parks. People who do not understand pack behavior create pack behavior problems by not being pack leaders. When that happens bad things happen.

The solution is to not go to dog parks because they are filled with uneducated dog owners with untrained dogs.

DOG KILLED AT DOG PARK

I originally found your site about 6 years ago. At the time, I was just starting to get into breeding GSDs, and was amazed at the sheer volume of information, tips, and common sense on your site. I was just on it today, and was reading your dog park article. There is one thing that you failed to mention in your article. When you have dog sitters, you MUST ALWAYS, and I mean ALWAYS make it crystal clear that they are not to take your dogs to dog parks. I was out of town for a few weeks, and a friend was keeping a few of my dogs at her place (the ones i could not take with me) I had a beautiful red sable 10 month old male out of slovakian and dr working lines.

Voodoo was not aggressive towards other dogs, usually, but Rachel took him, Chaos, and Bella to a local dog park. Voodoo was instantly attacked, and killed. I have never taken any of my dogs to dog parks, and was totally shocked that that was allowed to happen. the park was supervised, but the staff was busy elsewhere. Bella and Chaos brought parvo home that they obviously got at the dog park. I called the park office, and they told me that over 100 dogs had become sick with parvo after they, or other household dogs had visited.

Needless to say, I lost 2 litters, in addition to my 10 month old male. that park is in the middle of a class action lawsuit from several of the dog owners.

Thank your for your interest in our German Shepherd Dogs
Kaliber Kennels

Ed's Answer to A Dog Attack at a Dog Park:

You should sue the people who run this park.

A comment from a Dog Park Supporter:

Ed:

How do you allow people to post crazy unsubstantiated reports like this that make no sense ?

If there was a dog park in North America that had incurred 2 cases of parvo virus that news would be getting headlines in every major newspaper in the country.

If you had an ounce of sense in your head you should have been able to figure that out for yourself.

Instead of posting every single unsubstantiated story that comes to your attention, why don't you spend about 10% of your free time getting some details about the stories you post ??

Your web site is a f#$%@ing embarrassment and I have ZERO respect for you or any of your opinions.

Please THINK before repeating rumors that make no sense.

If you ever get any legitimate INFORMATION about a dog park fatality please either post the information to my group or at least ask the sender why they did not contact a newspaper about the incident.

Regards

Bill Z
WRZ
Camden County, NJ
ccdogpark@hotmail.com
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Dogpark-National-News/

Ed's Comments:

Bill

We are going to have to agree to disagree. We also have similar opinions of one another.

Ed

An Email from a person who manages the park in question:

I would like to address two issues regarding the post made by Julie Gatlin regarding 2 dogs being killed at the Plano Dog Park. This is not true. Our park has a section for big dogs and a section for little dogs. Signs are posted stating such. A person brought her little dog into the big dog area and was asked to go to the small dog area by members of the Plano Dog Park Association. She refused. Her little dog started running in the park and a Greyhound started chasing her dog and got to it. The small dog later died as a result of the injuries. This is the only incident regarding a death as a result of being at the Dog Park.

As for the comments regarding her dog being on leash inside the park, what is the purpose of having your dog ON leash inside an off leash park? We have signs posted at the entrances to the park, stating ALL DOGS MUST BE OFF LEASH INSIDE THE PARK. Why did Ms. Gatlin not follow the posted rules?

As for the city being dumb, we researched dog parks across the United States and Canada for years and found that the #1 issue is that all dogs MUST be off leash because if one dog is on leash inside the park, aggression may occur.

I encourage you to post the truth regarding Ms. Gatlin's post.

Thank you.

Debbie New [Debbien@plano.gov]

Ed's Comments on the dog park where a small dog was killed:

And your email is supposed to make this right? Your lack of understanding and ignorance about dog behavior seeps from your email like a festering wound.

Ed

Bills's obviously gone on TILT:

Ed:

You have no idea what the hell you are talking about !!

Debbie is 100% correct and you are an idiot. I can't emphasize that enough.

When someone contacts you with dog park questions please refer them to someone with some real knowledge and stop posting anonymous ravings that couldn't possibly be true!

If you had half a brain you'd be dangerous.

Don't bother taking those ridiculous messages down from your web site now. I'm posting something about you and your crazy ideas to my group today so other people can have a good laugh.

All I need to know is where you are located so I can warn local dog owners of your stupidity.

Regards,
Bill Zardus

ANOTHER READERS COMMENTS ON BILL

I just read your responses to Mr Frawley on the dog parks issue....

You should have put little dancing clowns on your responses since they are about the funniest ( and clearly ignorant) responses I've ever seen.

First, is it really your opinion that two or more cases of parvo would show up in the national news? If so, you don't understand the dynamics of the news industry. It would take a major epidemic covering an entire region for that to make the national news.

Second, having your dog on a leash when others are off-leash does not provoke aggression.   It's the lack of control by owners of aggressive dogs that are the problem. I for one would much rather an owner have an aggressive dog on-leash rather than off-leash - wouldn't you?   So your answer is that all dogs should be off-leash, regardless of aggression? Now that's just stupid.

And do you really think that people send emails to Leerburg about fake dog fights and deaths?   That makes a lot of sense. Yeah - dog fights at dog parks are so rare, Leerburg must be making them up...

I have seen numerous dog fights at the dog park I go to - all by aggressive dogs not being controlled by their owners (and have never sent Ed an email about them.)   I now carry a large pipe when I go to the dog park, and if your dog (or any dog) violently attacks my girls, then that dog will be limping home at best. And I would expect the same if my dogs got aggressive (although they follow me like I'm the dog whisperer at dog parks because they know I am their leader.)

And Debbie - I get the impression that the little dog that was killed by the greyhound was at fault for being loose in the big-dog park....   Granted, the owner was stupid for not using the right park, but the owner of the greyhound should be sanctioned for not maintaining control of their dog. What don't you understand?

Bottom line is - owners are responsible for their dog's deeds and controlling their actions - yet you imply that it's best to just let them all loose even though most owners have little (if any) control over their pets.   You must be stuck on stupid.

Unfortunately, you're both idiots and I can see why your dog park is dangerous...   Post that to your yahoo group, so we can all have a good laugh.

Fred

Dog Attacked in dog Parks:

Hi Ed,

I have a 1 year old boxer. He is not very dominant, has never initiated a fight, and does not really know what to do when another dog goes after him. In fact, he always backs down if a dog puts him in his place when he's getting annoying.

Just recently, there have been quite a few dogs that attack him out of the blue. I know that you are not a fan of dog parks, but when I took him there earlier today, one dog was hardly through the gate and viscously went after my dog and bit his leg. It scared me to death. That dog was immediately removed and another dog came in no more than 10 seconds later.
I was consoling my dog and checking him for bite marks, when another dog came in, sniffed him, and immediately went after him. Luckily, the owner and I were right next to them and were able to separate them right away. Both owners said that their dogs had never gone after a dog for no reason like that.

Like I said, my boxer has never started a fight. I would hate to stop taking him to parks because he loves to play with other dogs so much and I hate the idea of not letting him run off the leash since we just recently moved to the city and he is so used to running freely.

He is not neutered. Could dogs sense the increased testosterone and feel threatened? Should I get him neutered for this reason? Or, do you think he could possibly have something wrong with him that other dogs can sense?

The only health issues that he has right now is demodex. He also has some sores around his penis, which he has been cleaning very often. I have not yet had them checked out. Do you know if this is indicative of something else? Should I be concerned?
I'm just trying so hard to find a reason why some dogs go after him like that. Maybe there isn't one...

I would really appreciate your help. My dog means so much to me, as I'm sure you understand, and I am so afraid of something happening to him. Any advice that you may have would be greatly appreciated.

Sincerely,
Lisa (& boxer Riggs)

Ed's Answer to Dog Attacks in Dog Park.

There is no silver bullet here. This is a dominance/rank/lack of training and leadership problem. It has nothing to do with mange or your dog's testicles (not at one year and not according to your description).

Dogs don't need to be aggressive to be attacked - they only need to be in the presence of other dog aggressive dogs. Some dogs are so poorly trained and so dangerous they only need to see another dog to attack. If you are willing to gamble your dogs life on that - well go for it. This week I got an email from a lady whose young dog was killed in a dog park.

The ONLY SOULTION is to not go to dog parks. The fact is you should play with your dog and not rely on dogs to play with your dog. Dogs don't NEED OTHER DOGS TO PLAY WITH - that's a human misconception.

Your dog needs exercise it does not need to play with other dogs. Take your dog out and use some of the toys we sell and then use them to get the exercise your dog needs. When you do this you will notice - the bond with you and your dog will get better.

Subject: Beware of the Dog Park in Appleton,WI

Hi Everyone it was just brought to my attention that one of the puppies we sold to a couple was viciously attacked on Saturday. The attack happen at a place dogs are to go and be able to run and play. The dog park on French Rd and OO. According to a friend a adult pit bull was in the puppy area and attacked the puppy that was sitting next to the new owners. To save the puppies life the couple had to take it to the emergency animal hospital and incurred a $400 bill. I will be going to court with the new owners to make sure that a situation like this never occurs again. This pit bull has attacked 3 other dogs. I would like some input about how to go about getting vicious dogs that have attacked ban from the local dog parks. Please feel free to email me ....I will keep everyone posted as to the puppy's health and the court case.

Thanks
Anita (owner and breeder of German Shorthaired Pointers)

Comment on Dog Parks:

Mr. Frawley,

I am a first time owner of a Lab/Pointer mix and I wanted to thank you for your posted advice regarding many subjects, but especially Dog Parks. The dumb people I see at dog parks, the poorly trained dogs and the nasty conditions some are maintained in really add up to a bad situation. Prior to reading your article on the subject I thought they were an important part in raising a well mannered dog (socializing him etc.). Damn I was stupid. I stopped going immediately after reading your article as you identified many of the misgivings I had on the matter.

You pointed out that my dog does not need a dog park. I might be mildly retarded at times when it comes to raising the dog, but I am trying (with the aid of some of your videos). I'll be damned if I let someone else or someone else's dog ruin everything I am trying to do. I think if people took the time to objectively look at dog parks the way your article encouraged me to, they would see a situation they would not be comfortable taking anything they valued to. I am glad I stopped going prior to anything bad happening.

Thank you for the good advice

Noah

Dear Mr. Frawley,

I'm president of the Juniper Park Civic Association based in Queens, New York. We publish an all-volunteer community newsletter called the "Juniper Berry" with a circulation of 5,000 to our membership and residents. We would like to reprint your wonderful article (with your permission) on... "Dog Parks" Why They Are A Bad Idea !!! "It's Your Job to Protect Your Dog" ...in our newsletter. We will of course include a short bio about you, your web site and videos.

Currently the NYC Department of Parks & Recreation has an "unofficial policy," allowing dog owners to walk their dogs off-leash in NYC parks from 9pm to 9am. In June we had another serious attack on a 64-year old man in our neighborhood by an unleashed Rottweiler. He was trying to protect his leashed Shih Tzu. His small dog was seriously hurt but survived, the man will need skin grafts to repair his badly damaged arm. We have also seen several dog fights in our park observing much of the danger signs you talk about in your article. We feel it is important to let dog owners know of the issues and dangers of bringing their pets to a dog park.

I've also attached a letter from a woman who was walking her dog in Central Park in January when an unleashed dog killed her small dog. She is still heartbroken and has not received an adequate answer from NYC officials.

We have also filed a lawsuit against the NYC Parks & Recreation in an attempt to compel them to stop the dangerous practice of allowing unleashed dogs to roam free in our public parks. We plan to use your article as evidence of the problems that can result from dog parks. Our hearing is set for August 29th.

Thank you for your wonderful web site and informative articles. I've had dogs all my life and your articles are most enlightening.

If you agree to let us reprint your article please let me know if you have any photos that we could include in the article.

Sincerely,
Robert F. Holden
President
Juniper Park Civic Association
PO Box 790275 Middle Village, NY 11379
718-651-5865

Ed,

I wrote you earlier today about our 13 week old GSD and trying to make sure my husband is on board with training using your methods.

I just had to tell you that I’ve read several things on your web site about your adamant position regarding dog parks. I’ve had dogs in the past and never been to a dog park, but have friends that rave about what a great place it is to take the dog. I was sold on your position, however, after reading your article entitled “Dog Parks - Why They Are A Bad Idea!”

This evening my two older children went with me when I took the puppy for an evening walk in the neighborhood. Now, with my previous dog being dog-aggressive, I’m in the habit of staying WAY clear of any other dogs while on walks. A woman and her daughter were on the other side of the street, each of them with a dog on a leash. We chatted for a second from across the street and she told me that her gorgeous GSD was a pure bred, and what type (I don’t recall which, now). She asked about ours and said she was very well behaved for just being 13 weeks old. Then she said “you’ll have to bring her to the dog park soon!” I said something non-committal back to her like “oh, I keep hearing that.” We said our goodbyes and my kids and I started walking the opposite direction from her and her dogs, remaining across the street from her.

Seconds later I heard vicious snarling behind me and the woman across the street started screaming! As we turned around to look behind us, she had been DRAGGED out into the middle of the street by her GSD on his lead. Another woman on my side of the street had been coming around the corner behind where we’d just walked and had just rounded a bush at the corner. When the second woman saw the GSD and owner, instead of crossing the street where she needed to go she was going to zigzag across the street to avoid the GSD group.

The GSD saw her little mixed breed on his leash and yanked his owner out into the street behind him to THRASH the little mix. He dove in and had it by the neck and just looked like he was killing it. The GSD owner kept shrieking unintelligibly behind her dog, whose leash had pulled off with his collar during the fight. She was swinging the leash at his head and the other dog’s owner was trying to get her dog away from the GSD, but nothing was working. I know it seemed longer than it was. It felt like it lasted an hour. More likely, the actual attack was more like a minute and half of the attacking dog violently thrashing the smaller dog while snarling. The smaller dog wasn’t even making any sounds…

I scooped up my pup and moved farther down the street right away, but that was VERY SCARY. My pup started barking and whining in my arms and my kids were terrified. Eventually there were about 6 cars stopped in the road and people flying around everywhere trying to get the attacking dog off the other one. It was very badly hurt and they were on their way home to take it to the Vet.

There are several frightening and sad things about this in my mind.

First, the dog that was attacked was with an owner that was trying to avoid any contact between her dog and the attacking one.

Second, there was no way the owner of the attacking dog was getting her dog off the other dog. She had no control at that point.

Third, one of the folks that stopped to try to help was driving the woman and her attacked dog home up the street. I completely understand the GSD’s owner being concerned and wanting to see if things are okay with the dog that was attacked. HOWEVER, She turned around the other way and began walking behind us and our dog with both of her dogs to see if she could find the woman’s house. Now, if your dog had just lunged out of nowhere into the street to try to kill another dog, wouldn’t it make more sense NOT to take that dog with you to the woman’s house?! I just didn’t get it.

And, in my long-winded way I wanted to acknowledge for the skeptics I’ve seen posted on your site that you are 100% right about not going to dog parks. My dog will never be in one.

Dear Ed

I couldn't decide whether to write this email, as it brings up bad memories, but here we go...

Dog Parks, are really not good for socializing dogs, and not because of the dogs as much as the owners . Most dog owners go to dog parks to socialize they do not keep it moving, so the dogs only really hang out with the dogs they can get along with or have accepted into their pack. When an outside dog goes over to another pack of dogs usually he is not invited as the hierarchy of that particular group is already set up... Sometimes they will welcome the new dog sometimes not...

Sometimes, people have dogs off the leash that attack other dogs , and then the owners really do not know how to break up the fight... I have been in a situation where my dogs went over to play with another dog (all were off the leash ) and the dog was not having it, then he really tried to attack my dogs... The owner did nothing, and me i went yelling loudly at the dog, and then when he kept coming close I hit him with my leash... Needless to say I got in a loud yelling match with the other owner who was angry that i hit his dog....

Another time my young male (also a puli ) was playing with a very small pit bull, and it seemed like they were having fun, until the pit locked on my dogs ear.... the owner was able to get the dog off of my dog, and afterwards the pitt wanted to play, but my dog was not having it, he wanted to leave... which we did...

The other scenario, was with my husband, who is very athletic and takes the dogs to the park twice a day for exercise, I would say he does 4 miles each walk. He keeps them moving, and occasionally they play with dogs they know or have accepted in their pack. It had happened though that he kept running into this one woman with a german/collie mix (a big dog), and the dog was always attacking our dogs, so much so that if this particular dog saw them one field away he would go crazy and run toward them... One day this dog broke off the leash and bit my dog in the butt (thank god she has a lot of hair she is a puli) but no bite marks were left... My husband would tell me of his escapades, I thought he could handle the situation... He always said the owner apologized but he was really starting to get irked by her.... I knew my husband could handle himself so I did not worry, until one sunday, he comes in from the park, and he is really upset, and he said that the dog came charging after him, and he felt it was really going to do harm , so he hit the dog across the snout with a stick he found.. Well needless to say every one in that circle was up in arms and came after him yelling, about 10 days later he was arrested for hitting the dog, the police called the owner and the owner pressed charges, he had to go to court and he won the case and had charges dropped.... To this very day whenever I see the woman on the street walking her dog, if her dog sees my dogs, she has to give him treats to divert his attention and must walk the other way.. I can usually divert my dogs attention from the problem, but now they have picked up bad behavior of barking at dogs on the leash.

I have taking my dogs herding, and they are around other dogs and they never get into fights, but also the herding instructor has set up a very controlled situation..

As much as I like the park, and appreciate the off leash hours... I prefer to walk the dog during the on leash hours, and if I find a spot where no people are (usually during fall/ winter) then I will let them off the leash...

If people know their dogs attack other dogs, why have it off the leash, it u cannot control your dog why have it off the leash?

COMMENT on Dog Parks:

Dear Sir,

Your write up on the dangers of dog parks and the letters sent in by others I found both interesting and believable to my knowledge as a veterinary technician.

I know the focus of the article was on the violent perils of the parks. But do you have another article or section on the unseen dangers that animals and humans can pick up while having "fun"? For instance, the dogs and their human owners can get hookworms from walking in the wrong spot (though it would be a slim chance the owners would easily get the parasite directly from the park, since they'd have to be barefoot:). Other numerous intestinal parasites or protozoa could be left behind in the soil even if all the feces has seemingly been picked up. The potential problems are even more numerous for young dogs who have not been properly vaccinated for such problems as distemper or parvo virus! Don't forget about the kennel cough that unvaccinated dogs might pick up from unhealthy poochies around them.

I just thought you might want to alert your readers to the unseens. By the way, I used to work for one veterinarian who said that he loved dog parks--they brought him such good business.

Sincerely,
Meredeth

QUESTION:

With great interest I just read about dog parks. I have a 7 mo. old German Shepherd female. My obedience trainer suggested a puppy play group to better socialize Elsa with other dogs. Do you consider play groups like a dog park? I am not sure that this is the best for her. She does have fun, but you really do not know the other dogs temperaments and I have heard that if a shepherd has one bad dog experience it may be more aggressive towards other dogs? Thank you.

ANSWER:

This is a terrible idea. One never knows what the other pups are like and one pup can attack and injure another smaller pup.

Dear Ed,

I want you to know how thought-provoking I found your article on dog parks. We currently have two dogs, both female foundlings; a mix who appears to be mostly German Shepherd and Lab with some other bits and pieces, and a mostly, if not totally, Rottweiler.

Since they were puppies, we have taken them to our local dog park, from which they have contracted Parvo and some other minor doggie illnesses. I fully understand the dangers of dog parks, but am far more wary after reading the testimonials on your site.
There has been a history at our park of violence amongst the dogs, and I do believe that this is the fault mostly of idiot dog owners. For instance, the woman who brought her teething miniature poodle puppy to the park and let it "play" un-monitored with large, adult dogs. When it bit ones' ankle, it shook the puppy once by the scruff of its neck, and instantly killed it. On the other hand, the 6' 5", 280 lb guy with dreadlocks, I feel fully capable of backing up his three dashunds in a conflict.

In spite of this, I feel that we have a 'good' dog park, as far as what is admittedly an idea that asks for trouble goes, for several key reasons. First is that no dogs are allowed on leashes, because when one dog out of twenty is on a leash, that one is in "defense" mode of their owner.

Secondly, no personal toys are allowed in the park, but there are plenty of donated ones left lying by owners, so there are always enough to go around.

Third, I think that water is a key park dynamic. To avoid conflicts over water, there are about thirty different dishes in two areas at either end of the park, and owners fill recycled milk jugs with water and bring them to share. The closest to aggressive behavior that then manifests is dogs, usually smaller aggressive ones, putting their dirty paws in the water bowl when they're done drinking to ruin it for the other dogs, which can get the dog banned from the park.

Finally, I think we're just lucky. A person has never been attacked in our park unless they were trying to break up a fight. There's a designated "big dog" day on Sundays, and many of the dogs at the park don't socialize very heavily with the other dogs, but most of them stay with their owners, run through the bamboo stand, and enjoy being off a leash for a while.

Both of our dogs have been in fights before, but neither are at all aggressive towards other dogs. After reading this section of your site, I realize how lucky we are. I believe that while admittedly not as responsible as we could be, we are good dog owners, because we try to understand our dogs as animals. For instance, we make sure that our dogs know not to defend us personally with violence, because as alphas, we can take care of ourselves. When they were in fights, our dogs never caused it, and we would forcefully remove the other dog and alpha-pin them by the throat on their backs until their owners came, and then leave immediately with our dogs. At the park, they rarely try to go out of our sight, and we never let them. We never stay for more than an hour, and we watch closely any interaction they have with smaller dogs, who are easily intimidated but usually have big attitudes to go with it.

We have a strong bond with our dogs, but they are not well trained. I know that is irresponsible, but we can trust our dogs not to harm other people or dogs, because we put them in those situations all the time, and watch them carefully and punish aggressive behavior. Not at the dog park, but in controlled situations. This is important because our german-shepherd-lab mix, Luna, is very smart, and thinks of ingenious ways to get her and her sister out of the backyard, including digging behind the shed against the fence, where we can't see. When they get out, we worry for their safety from cars, but we know that they won't bother other people or dogs. Most of the time, by the time we know they're gone, they'll be waiting in the front yard to be let in. Also, since they are both large breeds and we can't walk them long enough each day for them to get enough exercise, especially on leashes, since we can't keep up, we've taken to walking them around without leashes around 10 PM or later, or riding bikes with them running beside.
Occasionally, of course, we will meet someone, and I don't know if it's from interaction at the dog park or not, but we never have any problems, though we grab their collars immediately for the other person or dog-walker's state of mind. If any other dog shows aggression, our dogs will run straight back to us, because they expect us to protect them, and don't appear to be overly concerned with showing the other dog its place.
After reading your article on dog parks, I realize that our dogs' behavior could completely change just from one bad encounter. I don't think we'll bring them back. I also am repelled by the people who bring their young children with them to dog parks. Even kids who've had a dog their whole life very often don't understand animal-friendly behavior, or how to read animal warning signs.

I believe that you know what you're talking about, and I really don't; what knowledge I may have from owning dogs is nothing to what you know from being a professional. I would appreciate any comments you have on our dogs. I understand that you believe that a well-trained dog is a safe dog, and I believe that too, but we frankly don't have the guts or money to fiercely train our dogs, and we don't keep any dogs that we can't control, so I suppose this works for us.

Anyway, I was really affected by this article, and have taken also your advice to heart on how to break up a dog fight.

Sincerely,
Stella

Comment:

Always reviewing dog sites/information, etc.

I have 3 female golden retrievers (1 is still a young pup)

Anyway, your article on WHY not to take you dog to dog parks was the best!

We have a local dog park in our town, and the sites I have seen in there are scary. No one watches their dogs and there are a lot of fights, attacks with dogs because of this.

I was in the dog park ONCE and only once with my young puppy about 6 months ago (she was 6 months old) and my older golden 7 yrs old. My 7 yr old is a CGC and Registered Therapy dog and So well behaved … no one was in the dog run with me.

However, a man came in with a lab and while my 7 yr old was just lying beside me , the lab immediately ran over to her and I could not believe the dog fight. This lab attacked my golden retriever for no reason... and the best was when I asked him to take his dog away, he said to me I don't want to get bit! He had no control over his own dog.

Needless to say, I have never been back there again.

You are so right in not take your dogs to the dog park!

My dogs play with each other of course and quite a few of MY friends dog, who I know and trust and who are well mannered. I am more fun than other dogs anyway. I would rather them pay attention to me first, which they do.

Good article!

Dog Park Question:

Hi Ed,

Thank you so much for the off-leash dog park article. I will never go to an off-leash dog park ever again! I had been about a dozen times without a problem, until last week. My dog is a 4 years old neutered Husky. We got him from the Humane Society about 2 years ago and he has never shown aggression towards any dogs. We were having a blast at the local off-leash dog park which is also a beach (very beautiful). He seemed to enjoy playing with the other dogs that were mostly Retrievers and Labs. We were just heading out of the park when this tiny Pomeranian (about 4 lbs) dog came into the park and then my dog just pounced on the little dog (I believe it was a his prey drive that kicked in..like the Pomeranian was a little bunny)!! I yelled "STOP" and my dog immediately stopped but he had the time to take 2 bites at the little dog in less than 2 seconds. The woman picked her dog up and cried and I ran after her to give her my name and my phone number. The vet called me and asked me about the incident (how old my dog was, if he has played with dogs before, neutered, ....etc). The little dog had a couple of broken vertebrates and could not walk but proved to have movement in the legs. The woman that owns the little dog expects me to pay the entire vet bill and I am a full-time student just barely making it. I paid for half of the first visit with cash. Can I be held completely accountable for this incident? I mean, she is also the one that is responsible for her dogs safety. Who takes a Pomeranian dog where dogs that weight 50 lbs run?

Thank you...
I hope to hear back from you soon.

Mary.

Cindy's Response:

Dog parks are one of the worst ideas ever, as you have discovered.

I don’t know where you live or what the laws are, but if your dog jumped on this Pomeranian then you did not have that dog under control. Admittedly, anyone with a small dog who places it on the ground with loose large dogs is making a mistake but the fact is your dog was not listening to you. You are responsible for your dog’s behavior.

It doesn’t matter if your dog was being aggressive or not, he seriously injured another animal. I would try to work this out with the owner, and see what you can come up with. In this day and age of law suits, I would get everything said between the two of you in writing.

Cindy Rhodes

Question:

Hi,

I own a Japanese Akita Dog.

I wish to purchase a leather collar minimum of 2" width to protect him against another dogs bite. Basically I want to offer my dog full protection from an attack against a vicious dog that could harm him in any way.

Some dogs such as pit bulls and staffie's go for the throat and I simply want to give my dog the added protection of a collar that would offer him better protection.

Clearly, I do not believe in dog fighting and I have done everything I can to socialize my dog with humans and other dogs. You must understand though that not everyone takes this course of action and I want to protect my dog. My question to you is this:

Which dog collar do you sell that would offer my dog the above protection. let me know and I will purchase it from you. I would like it to be black if you have black and preferably leather.

Thanks,
Martyn

Ed's Response:

This is a simple thing – you either don’t take him to these places or you start to act like a pack leader (which you are not doing) . Read the article I wrote on Why Dog Parks Are A Bad Idea. You can find the list of 300 or so training articles I have written.

With that said – if you are out and a dog approaches it is YOUR RESPONSIBILITY as the PACK LEADER to drive these stray dogs away. You are not doing this and as such you are not acting like a pack leader.

I suggest that you continue to read my free eBooks on pack structure and leadership. Read what I have written on dominant dogs.

Bottom line is this is 100% a handler problem and not a dog problem. Its up to you to educate yourself and then apply this knowledge. It is ridiculous to think that buying a wide collar is a solution to this problem.

Kind Regards,
Ed Frawley

Question:

Hi, I have an obedient albeit "active," somewhat submissive, 1.5 year old , 70 lb male black lab cross who is an attack magnet when we find ourselves in the company of stray dogs while walking in our neighborhood. His tail is similar to a Newfoundland's tail but carried a little higher in a playful manner, he walks high on his toes, and gallops around with abundant energy and playfulness. His ears fold down like a lab, and he has a smooth streamlined appearance.

After having adopting him from a shelter when he was 4 months old, we noticed he had horrible nightmares - dreams of play fighting with other dogs they were not - and wondered if this created some odd disposition which made him an attack magnet to other dogs. He often bows when approaching small dogs and has always been only somewhat submissive when challenged at dog parks but mainly preoccupied with playing ball. Of all the dogs we've had over the years, we've NEVER run into this problem. Is there a way we can train him to not attract dominant dogs from across the play field who come exclusively to attack him as soon as he is leashed. (He has been attacked by two Bull Mastiffs together, two different Wolf hybrids, a Corgy, and a Jack Russell).

Any help at all would be greatly appreciated.

Patricia

Ed's Response:

This is a simple thing – you either don’t take him to these places or you start to act like a pack leader (which you are not doing). Read the article I wrote on WHY DOG PARKS ARE A BAD IDEA. You can find the list of 300 or so training articles I have written.

With that said – if you are out and a dog approaches it is YOUR RESPONSIBILITY as the PACK LEADER to drive these stray dogs away. You are not doing this and as such you are not acting like a pack leader.

I suggest that you continue to read my free eBooks on pack structure and leadership. Read what I have written on dominant dogs.

Bottom line is this is 100% a handler problem and not a dog problem. Its up to you to educate yourself and then apply this knowledge.

Kind Regards,
Ed Frawley

Comment:

Ed,

Although I do not currently own a dog, I will never frequent a dog park again. I had a beautiful male collie that was a natural alpha that I took to a few different parks and I never realized what danger I was exposing him to. I am a “cat person” and only had the dog because he was so exceptional and was in a shelter. I had NO idea that taking him to a dog park could have ended his life.

I have seen emails from others declaring that you are off base with your views on dog parks and that your opinions are unfounded, but I beg to differ. I have witnessed aggressive behavior myself and have seen it reported in the news. If you ever need to back up any of your statements on dog parks, please refer the individual to the following story from Broomfield, CO that was linked to CNN’s web site. The link is below.

http://www.thedenverchannel.com/news/13835826/detail.html

Thank you for continuing to take a stand on this issue.

Terri

Dog Park Experience :

Hi Ed!

Bought many of your products and watch your DVD's over and over... I taught my 3 Rottweilers since 8 weeks old everything I learned from you! You have always emphasized how much you think dog parks are a bad idea, I always followed your advice and stayed away from dog parks for years. However, today I took 2 of my Rotts to a dog park to swim in a fresh water lake, I kept my dogs on leash at all times unless they were swimming in a secluded area... When it was time to leave I placed my dogs on leash and proceeded to exit the park while every other dog owner had their dog off leash. A few dogs approached me and my Rotts aggressively, I pleaded with the owners to put your their dogs on leash! They just laughed and said their dogs were harmless, I then said well mine have had basic Schutzhund training and will attack if they feel either I or them selves are threatened... sure enough the same dog owner I waned less then a minute ago lets his dog loose of leash and the dog came at me and my Rotts barking and snapping. My Rottweiler in turn got a hold of the dog and attacked this guy's dog... The whole entire dog park then turned on me and said I should put my dog to sleep and that they were calling the cops! Ed, I see now why you always have said what a bad idea dog parks are!!!!! I left before the authorities came, but if and when they show up to my house, am I in the wrong? My dog was on leash and his was not!

Dog Park Question:

I wanted to ask if citronella spray would work in a dog fight? I have 2 dogs male and female both have a bit of pit in them. I took them to the dog park today which I had not done in a year or more. They did awesome for about half hour when another female lab came in and started a fight with my girl pit. Well my Bambi did not want to back down after that and they had a pretty good fight until we got them apart. Which we did not do correctly after I read your article. I am in the process of becoming a foster for bad rap (pit bulls) so I need to know what to do. I know they will teach me how to break up a fight but I'm more concerned when I'm by my self. Since I have 1 of each sex, is a male or female better to foster? My male is mostly lab he is 8yr. and my girl is 3yr.

Thanks, Sonja

Answer:

Sonja,

Citronella has about as much of a chance of breaking up a dog fight blowing in their ear and whispering sweet nothings.

I strongly suggest you get some education on pack structure and obedience training because doing what your doing is foolish and dangerous. Sorry for being blunt but I am writing a book on dog aggression and have folders of emails from people like yourself who were badly bitten in a dog fight or ended up with dead dogs.

Read the free eBooks on my web site - My web site has a large number of FREE eBooks that I have written. Go to the main directory for eBooks http://www.leerburg.com/dogtrainingebooks.htm

Read the one on DOG PARKS and on HOW TO BREAK UP A DOG FIGHT WITHOUT GETTING HURT !!

Read the one on Establishing Pack Structure – I strongly recommend that you get several of my DVD’s:

Establishing Pack Structure with the Family Pet

Basic Dog Obedience

Remote Collar Training for the Pet Owner

These DVD's will educate you – they contain the information you desperately need to have safe calm submissive dogs. For your sake I hope you follow this advice.

By the way – I have a large section in my book on MALE ON FEMALE AGGRESSION. So don’t think sex is going to keep you out of trouble. That’s false hope.

Comment:

Dear Mr. Frawley,
I e-mailed previously regarding the installation by the City of Torrington, Ct. of a dog park in a strictly residential neighborhood. Not one neighbor was notified of this and we didn't find out until the fencing was being installed. It is on a two and one half acre area, with fencing just yards from a residence. There is a foster home across the street with six young children. The fence is four feet high, and it is to be used by the 35,000 residents of our city. The city is already refusing responsibility for property damage, dog bites etc. We as residents are supposed to catch the offending dog, confront the owner and "make them responsible" for injuries when a dog attacks a child or another pet while in it's own yard. Dog owners have already driven into our neighborhood and abused the property even though it is posted and not opened yet. One dog already went after a child on a bike. I believe that these people are ignorant of dog behavior and have no idea what will happen when Fluffy meets a Rottweiler. There is no water source on the grounds for dogs, except on private property that adjoins the fence. This was done by administrative review and there have been no land use, environmental impact studies or even a posting of the proposal on the property. IT is supposedly going to be cleaned by volunteers who live at least 5 miles away. The reason we have been told that it was put here, was because these same dog owners have abused the city parks so badly that they are unwanted there. We have six dogs and they are enclosed in a six foot solid vinal fenced in yard. Let the non stop barking start!

Comment:

Hi, Ed:
After reading all your posts re how dog parks are a bad idea, I must say I have to agree with you. I have taken my 24-lb cockapoo puppy (11 mo) a few times to our local dog park and have witnessed more than one dog fight there. Today my puppy was bullied by a Shiba Inu/Chow mix - no fighting, just the other dog kept mounting my puppy and not letting him up. Brody (my dog) finally stood up for himself (no biting, just let other doggy know NO MORE) and I separated the two (owner did nothing and the other dog was 60 lbs - I just calmly separated the dogs, leashed mine and led him away standing as TALL as I could to show dominance) but I KNOW the experience was not a good one for my puppy. Here's my question -my puppy LOVES other dogs is there any chance this experience has ruined him in some way? I am scared it might (no evidence as to that yet). But in effect, could it wreck his love of other dogs? I will never go to another dog park again. Also, what about doggy day cares? He is in the small dog/sr. dog area and dogs are monitored by staff, is that okay for him? We work 8 hrs/day and I don't want him to get lonely, do you think it's okay if he goes to doggy day care once a week? Please let me know - I love him so much and don't want to endanger him in any way.

Thanks,
Suzan

Question:

Hi Ed -- Great website with tons of info!

I am wondering about dog park safety in Raleigh, NC, i.e. I am told that the dog parks here are safe and yet your website has me questioning if that is true.

Have you heard of any incidents in the Raleigh/Durham/RTP area?

Thanks for your help,
Ginny

Ed's Comment:

Why would you think that dog parks in your town would be any different than dog parks in any other town? This is not about a TOWN – it’s about pack behavior. It doesn’t matter if you’re in China.

Kind Regards,
Ed

Question:

I have a nine month old Boxer-Lab mix, Zachary. He is fun loving - loves dogs and people, but I am wondering if I am making mistakes with him. I have been taking him to a local dog park since he was 4 months old. He loves it. This dog is fun loving and loves to play and romp with all dogs. But he is full of energy and he is very strong and some dogs don't want to be bothered. He will usually learn which dogs want to play and run and wrestle with him, but occasionally he will be too much for a given dog. At these times I will get his attention and put him back on leash to calm him down.

Recently one dog at the park became quite agressive with Zachary, not once but two or three times the dog came after Zachary and growled and lunged towards him. I immediately put Zachary on leash and took him home. Then another day at the park we ran into a Husky that was agressive towards Zachary, growling and snapping. I immediately put Zachary on leash, informed the owner of the Husky of his dog's behavior, and took Zachary home.

Now I have noticed that Zachary has a new bevavior. Whenever I am walking him on leash and we see another dog up ahead, Zachary will go down in a crouch position and watch intently as the other dog approaches us. Since he doesn't want to move from this position I let Zachary stay like this. When the other dog gets near us, Zachary will get up to sniff the other dog and then he wants to play. One time it was two dogs and Zachary immediately rolled over on his back and exposed his undersides and belly in a very submissive position while he allowed the dogs to sniffed him up. When Zachary got up and we were leaving one of the other dogs snarled agressively at Zachary.

Here are my questions: Is it normal behavior for Zachary to get to down in a crouch as another dog approaches? Is it normal for Zachary to get in such a submissive posture for other dogs? Am I ruining Zachary by brining him to the dog park? He gets great excersize off leash there and he loves to go there, but I don't want to continiue if it is harming him either psychologically or otherwise.

Thanks
Joe

Answer:

I wouldn't be taking him to a dog park; we don't feel they are healthy for most dogs. Sooner or later, your dog will be involved in fight. It's not IF, it's WHEN. He's becoming a young adult and as he becomes more mentally and physically mature I would expect more conflicts with other dogs as he tries to establish his rank.

We will take our dogs to a park ONLY to work our obedience with the distractions of the other dogs. We do not allow our dogs to interact with the dogs there at all, and if a dog were to approach us we would drive them away. This is only when we have a dog fully trained and we need to proof with distractions. Taking dogs to a dog park for exercise is not something we agree with. Dogs don't 'need' to play with dogs outside their family pack, and the time would be better spent playing with your dog yourself and working on training.

Read the article on dog parks.

Cindy

Comment:

Hi Ed,
I came across your site on a google search. You are right on with the dog park thing. I go to a 40 acre forest preserve dog park not the chain link fence type where people drink starbucks while their dogs play. I love it and go there with my three dogs for a walk in the woods. It is getting more and more like a dog park to me and I have to go at non crowded times because I have a shepard mix who will want to attach certain dogs. Thanks for your great website.
Laura

Thanks:

Dear Ed,

Following my wife’s injury by an uncontrolled German shepherd at a dog park and the reaction of animal control to the event (it wasn’t the dog’s or its owner’s fault), I began a research project that has generated the following blog:
http://rosevilledogparks.wordpress.com/

I have liberally linked to you in it, including the headline photo of the first post which links directly to your dog park publication. I hoped you wouldn’t mind, but would like you to take a look to make sure the representation is ok with you.

I used to work in EMS, and as I currently work in the Sierra Nevada Mountains with the Girl Scouts at a backpacking camp (with my wife who was recently injured), I have had numerous occasion to work with German shepherds in search and rescue and K-9 enforcement, and have grown to greatly admire both the dogs’ abilities and those of their handlers. It is frankly magical to me what they can do, and it is equally stunning that slobs like the owners of the dog that hurt my wife can own and treat such an animal like a beagle.

Thanks for the information you’ve posted for the rest of us to learn, and do please make sure my citation is ok with you.

Many thanks,
Bill

Comment:

Hello Ed,

I just recently discovered your web site and think it provides the best information on dogs and dog training I have found. I also just purchased a couple of your CDs. We just added a new dog to our home and I have been following you advice about introducing a new dog. So far it is working great!

Anyway this news story just hit the paper today and I thought I would share it with you.

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Report: Five-year-old attacked at dog park, owner sneaks away

A Fort Collins woman is asking for help in identifying the owner of a dog that allegedly attacked and bit her 5-year-old son at the Spring Canyon dog park.

Alisa Bennett’s son was at the Spring Canyon Community Park dog park with his nanny and 4-year-old brother when a black and white malamute attacked him, according to Bennett and a report filed with Larimer Humane Society’s animal control department.

The nanny had taken the two boys and the family’s German shepherd to the park so the dog could swim in the newly opened pond at about 9 a.m. Saturday.

The owner of the malamute entered the park and caused some concern to the dog owners.

“(The owner) said (the dog) really liked kids, but the behavior was odd enough, so the nanny held both boys’ hands,” Bennett said.

The boys were standing quietly when the malamute came up from behind, bit the boy in the posterior, and knocked him over. He proceeded to bite the boy while he was on the ground, according to the report.

As park attendees rushed over to check on the screaming boy, the owner grabbed the dog and left the park.

No one was able to provide Larimer Humane Society’s animal control department with any description of the car or the owner’s license plate number, but the owner was described as a male in his 20s with long hair. The dog’s name is believed to be “Seek.”

“I feel really angry and I feel let down,” Bennett said. “To see a child get hurt and attacked and take off? The other people in the dog park flocked to see if my son was OK. They all wanted to see the condition of my little boy but the owner of the dog didn’t.”

See Tuesday's Coloradoan for more

A link to the story is here http://www.coloradoan.com/article/20090629/UPDATES01/90629020/1002/rss

-------------------------

I live in Fort Collins, CO and dog parks all the rage here...I personally don't like them and after reading about them on your site I know I won't ever go to one.

I hope you find the story interesting...

Mark

Email:

I found your site to be informative. I am writing you today because after reading your sight and the references to the Plano Dog Park I would like to make a comment about some other dog parks in the Dallas Area.

I take my 8 month old American Bulldog Puppy to the dog park all the time. I find that many people at the dog park do not follow the rules and then make you feel bad when your bigger dog "scares" their little dog. It is COMPLETELY inappropriate for a small dog to be in the large dog enclosure.

My dog is not aggressive but she is getting to the age where she is getting big and strong quickly. She plays well with other dogs her size or larger but is only good with little dogs who are not intimidated by larger dogs and will stand their ground and play rough with her. She plays has played with a French Bulldog, Mini Schnauzer, Boston Terrier and Jack Russell. All of these dogs were at the dog park in the larger enclosure and not afraid of large dogs. She can scare the small dogs easily because she just comes running like a Mack truck and can easily knock me off my feet let alone a 15lb Poodle.

THIS IS THE REAL REASON I AM ON THE WEB SO LATE BECAUSE I AM STILL WORKED UP OVER AN ISSUE THAT HAPPENED TODAY....

Today, we went to the dog park in Addison, Texas and when we went to go in a group of 4 or 5 male dogs ran to the gate and started growling and barking at my dog as we were trying to come in. She had no response since she is used to this. We have two older male Dalmatians and she drives them crazy running and jumping on them. She is just not phased by it and showed no aggression.

I pushed the dogs away and let her go in to run and play. None of the other owners even said a word to their dogs when we where attempting to come inside. I noticed a few dogs were there and they were large and the I noticed a problem. An older gentleman had his two small poodles in with the larger dogs. I saw that they were hiding behind the bench that backs up to the fence. At the time, I did not know he also had a large dog in the BIG DOG ENCLOSURE. I should have just gotten back into the car and that would have been the end of but no I wanted to let our dog run around today.

I know my dog is rough and it can be an issue with smaller dogs. She is a puppy and likes to roughhouse, so I explained to the gentleman that she had issues with playing rough smaller dogs and I would watch her but I did not want her over by them so please be cautious if you were going to keep them on this side of the park. He said fine and basically ignored me. Sure enough the poor little poodles came out from behind the bench a few minutes later and my dog saw them and ran over to try and play. I asked the gentlemen to move so I could get my dog out from under the bench and he said "Oh don't worry about it my dogs are fine." I said no I wanted to get my dog out from behind the bench where his dogs were hiding because she is rough with smaller dogs when she plays. He responded to me with a "WHATEVER."

Sure enough one of his dog was scared and snapped at mine and lunged toward our dog. Our dog then ran toward her and I grabbed her by the collar. In all of the racket and fuss, all of the dogs came running over and this became a huge mess. Thankfully no fights only a little growling so no one or dog was hurt. (Later this evening we notices our dog did receive an puncture wound on her jowl and a bruise under her eye).

I apologized to the gentlemen and asked if the dog was ok. He asked me "What my f***ing problem was?" I was speechless because I was so mad. I asked him why his small dog was in with the big dogs... His answer was I HAVE A BIG DOG AND TWO SMALL DOGS I CAN'T BE IN TWO PLACES AT ONE TIME!!! At this point I said read the sign.... and walked away.

I am still fuming which is why I am researching dog parks on the internet at MIDNIGHT!!! This is not the first time this has happened at this particular dog park. The last time we were there a lady brought her poodle mix in and the moment she let the dog down it started to yelp and ran away squealing to a corner of the large enclosure. This caused a huge mess with dogs trying to chase him and I decided we needed to leave. I found out the lady told another dog owner that her dog was afraid of other dogs (large & small) --- STUPIDITY!!!

My husband says I should just stay away from dog parks because you can fix stupid. I am really starting to think he is right. If the people would have gotten of their fat lazy behinds today and watched their dogs instead of sitting on the bench or their lawn chairs sipping their drinks maybe they would have seen the signs. Little dogs and big dogs don't mix at the dog park at all.

Here I am trying to be proactive because I know she is going to try and play with all dogs and will be rough if given the opportunity. She is 65 lbs and does not realize how big she is and thinks every dog is there to play with her. For one, many of the people who have the little dogs are ignorant for taking them in the large dog area in the first place. Two, many owners do use the dog park as socialization for them and not their pets. Three, some people should not have had kids let alone dogs if you are not responsible bad things will happen.

We are experienced pet owners who at one time owned 4 rescued Dalmatians (2 Males & 2 Females). Now we just have our two older boys and our little puppy. I have had numerous trips to the human hospital and animal hospital due to our boys fighting over territory in the house. Our one female dal was very dominant and the other female was very passive. I know the signs and know that today after 10 years of being together the only reason they don't fight is they are too old and lazy (14 & 16) but they do growl, snap and sometimes every now and then pretend like they are going to fight. No blood is every shed but I am always on guard at mealtime for humans and feedings for dog and when they all congregate at the water bowl at the same times. I know that the boys are aggressive to males and I HAVE NEVER TAKEN THEM TO THE DOG PARK. I know that they would never tolerate the craziness that happens there and would bite another dog or attack it.

I am smart enough to know that anytime there is more than one dog dominance will need to be established and if both want to be dominant than that spells T-R-O-U-B-L-E!!! This is why I am so cautious with the little one but it only takes one time for a dog to be seriously injured or be killed.

I have decided that we will no longer be going to Addison Dog Park, The Plano Dog Park or the Dallas Dog Park. I do not even think I will go to UNLEASHED - they new indoor dog park that is privately owned. I don't want to take the chance and have our dog hurt another dog or be hurt by another dog.

I just wanted to vent. Thanks for a good site and the intelligence to post all viewpoints. I like that part the most.

Rae
Addison, TX

Answer:

You can read our view of dog parks for the average pet owner here.

We get more emails from people who have bad experiences than good. Most people have no idea how to read dog body language and many of the people who take their dogs to the park have no control.

I think your husband is right; you should probably stay out of the park. For me, they serve no purpose as I want my dogs to be interacting with me when we are out for some fun and exercise. I don’t want my dogs getting their needs met by strange dogs. If I want to proof my dog’s training with distractions there a lot of safer places to go and do that

Personally, I think if you can’t control your big dog around dogs of any size then you have no business having your dog off leash around dogs at all to begin with. Sorry if that isn’t what you want to hear but the size of the dogs in question should not matter. Your dog can easily knock you off your feet, but you let her loose with other people and dogs? It sounds like an accident waiting to happen.

The fact that your own pack of dogs have fought enough over the years for you to write this scares me the most. "I have had numerous trips to the human hospital and animal hospital due to our boys fighting over territory in the house."

I question your ability to deal with a dog park scenario, if your own dogs at home are fighting in this way. Please take some time to train your puppy and learn to keep her under control.

I’d also direct you to the search function in the upper left corner of the website. It will find posts, articles and Q & A’s that deal with your search terms.

Comment:

Ed,

Thanks for your excellent article on dogs parks and in particular on how to break up a dog fight without being injured. (I only wish I had read it before my golden retriever Storm and I were attacked by a very large pit bull at a campground on Labor Day weekend). The 150# mix dragged a 12 year old out of their campsite and across the road to get at my leashed dog. A dog that size should have been attached to a tree, not a 90# kid. I don't have pictures but I should not have jumped in to try and equalize the fight. Got a few really good bites and some nasty scratches. My dog Storm got a minor bit on his ear.

The problem is that each time this happens it makes my dog really worry about another dog's intentions when they approach. Thankfully my dog is whistle trained and will pretty much ignore other dogs at the park when we are playing. I still don't ever let him meet other dogs off leash. The guy with the pit bull was on his phone and came over after the fight was broken up.

He claimed that his dog never started a fight and that my dog must have done something. I tried to explain to him that in Wisconsin a police report is required when a dog attacks a person. I tried to explain how dangerous it might be if a small child walked up to his dog and was attacked. I explained to him that things sometimes happen and that I wanted to be sure it didn't happen again as the next time someone might sue him for all that his trailer was worth. He got very defensive and wanted to "take care" of any legal issues right now (about the same attitude as his dog had). From now on I will take your advice and bring a walking stick to the dog park.

Thanks for the really good advice that you have posted for free, I have a few things that I will use to re enforce my dog's good behavior...and to the several people who were abusive to you on your website, (probably aggressive dog owners) if your dog is out of control and off leash in a public area, it better not come after my on leash under control dog. I will make very sure it Never does it again.

Thanks,
D. G.

Comment:

Hi,

I just wanted to say that finding the leerburg site at 2 am on my last nightshift at work has changed my life. No really. I have two 22 month old female litter sister miniature bullterriers and then (ignorantly) added a third, now 9 months. The litter sisters fought as early as four months old. Not long ago they fought again and I was alone and had no idea how to break it up. In the end there was blood and pieces of flesh and I was just so traumatised. In reality it took the girls to fight and hurt themselves so badly for me to finally search for a qualified answer. Nearly every single thing that Ed wrote about has happened to me - the fighting, the ranking issues and about the power of the a pack of three dogs.

The best article, on dog parks (where my girls were attacked at a young age) made me feel so relieved. I will never go back. I had no idea I was supposed to protect them. I ordered the dominant and aggressive dog dvd straight away. I watched it and slipped from the couch to the floor. Finally I wiped away all the tears and got up - I re-erected their crates and separated the girls. I watched more videos. I walked them separately and took one day at a time. They are not allowed in my bedroom at all and I am trying to establish myself as the leader in their lives. I am a psychotherapist and have learnt to understand why and how people act and react the way they do and it never once occured to me to investigate the language of dogs. I felt so ashamed.

The girls are doing well and the most most amazing thing is that now that they are crated and I dont have potential chaos on my hands at any one moment - life has become so much more manageable. They love their crates and I am hoping that one day they might be able to supervised together for short periods of time again. I dont know yet if that day will come. I am learning as much as I can all the time and hopefully they will respect me one day soon.

Thank you for your clear articulated truthful answers and qualified experienced based knowledge that has helped my girls and myself come to terms with reality and hopefully a more structured and safer future.

Comment:

Dear Mr. Frawley,

I read your lengthy article on why off leash dog parks are a terrible idea, and it really hit home. After reading, I promised my pup I would never take her to such a potentially dangerous environment.

Unfortunately our favorite city park has a small corner dedicated to a fenced in dog area, and recently people have started to ignore the park's leash rules and let their dogs swim freely in the lake behind the "bark park." We went for our usual evening jog tonight and as we rounded a copse of trees we saw a huge dog playing in the water about 50 feet from the trail. The owner was there but the dog was off leash, and of course it immediately saw us and charged my 4 month old puppy.

The noise was terrible, this dog was massive and just kept stomping on her, and I was honestly scared as it clearly weighed more than me (I'm very petite). The dog's owner was completely ineffectual, yelling at her crazed beast from the water's edge. Since it clearly was not going to listen to it's owner, I finally got up the nerve to start kicking it (I wish so badly that I'd had a chain leash or my OC spray with me), the fat cow finally got over and hauled the dog off mine, and we got the hell out of there. As we were leaving I told her she needed to control her dog or it was likely to seriously hurt someone, and some guy standing nearby had the audacity to tell me, "They're just dogs!"

Oh yeah yeah, they're just 100+ lbs of muscle and teeth, and your inability to control them could have, oh I don't know, KILLED my dog or ME. I was so mad I was shaking! I warned everyone on the way out about the aggressive and uncontrolled black lab, and we will NEVER go to our once-favorite park again. Dixie came out unscathed, but she's at such an impressionable age that we'll have to see if the negative memory of that incident will need to be worked out in the future.

I pride myself on being very good to my dogs, and having well behaved and balanced animals in general, and it never ceases to amaze me just how little some people care about properly training an animal that could quickly and easily go haywire. I deeply respect and thank ANYONE who takes the time to understand dogs and refuses them even the opportunity to get out of hand.

Thank you again for your article, and now that I unfortunately have first hand experience with the subject, I'll be promoting your site to all of my friends, even those without dogs. AND I'll be carrying my so-powerful-it's-borderline-illegal OC spray with me at ALL times.

Ed's Response:

I would recommend carrying a can of bear spray. We sell it on our website. You would have been 100% justified in using it tonight. Fact is when the stupid woman who owned the dog got it in her car she would have got a dose of the spray.

Good luck with your dog. Sometimes things like this have a life long effect on a puppy - it makes them dog aggressive for the rest of their lives.

Regards,
Ed Frawley

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The Purpose OfA Dog Park

The Dangers of Dog Parks

Dog Packs in the Park

How to Handle Your Dog in the Dog Park

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News & Media Articles about Dog Parks

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Report: Five-year-old attacked at dog park, owner sneaks away

The Purpose Of
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