Spaying the Female
#11301 - 01/19/2004 10:42 AM |
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I have a six month old Dutch shepherd puppy that I intend to train and use for personal/family protection.
I read the thread on neutering the male dog and want to know if the same rules apply to females?
Just wanting to do the right thing.
Thanks in advance!
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Re: Spaying the Female
[Re: Jim Janusek ]
#11302 - 01/19/2004 11:51 AM |
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I recommend you wait until she has been through one season before you spay her. I worked at a clinic that did early spay/neuter and though they claim it is a totally safe procedure, there are lasting side effects that can and do happen. They operate under the idea of getting rid of the overpopulation problem as their number one concern. The side effects I am speaking of are urinary incontinece in females who are spayed early, and some concerns of physical and mental maturity problems. Having lived with a 'leaker' for years, I would rather go through the heat cycle than have to clean up piddle for the rest of the dog's life.
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Re: Spaying the Female
[Re: Jim Janusek ]
#11303 - 01/19/2004 01:59 PM |
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If you spay a female dog before the growth plates in her bones close, her bones will continue to grow for a longer time than if she had been left intact... same as what happens to neutered male dogs. She will end up being somewhat taller at maturity than if she was left intact, or if she was spayed after the growth plates close.
The other thing that happens in male and female dogs if spay / neutered before maturity is that their lifetime risk of deadly osteosarcoma (bone cancer) increases by a factor of 3-4.
The growth plates will close sometime after 12 mo. of age, so I'd be inclined wait until she's at least 18 mo. old before spaying.
OTOH, a bitch's lifetime risk of mammary cancer (breast cancer) increases with each heat cycle she goes through in the first few years of her life. So if I was going to spay a bitch, I'd be inclined to not wait more than 2 or 3 heat cycles.
Spayed bitches have about a 10-20% chance of developing urinary incontinence due to the loss of estrogen.
Spayed bitches are at higher risk of becoming overweight or even obese.
Laura Sanborn
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Re: Spaying the Female
[Re: Jim Janusek ]
#11304 - 01/19/2004 04:07 PM |
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Deanna wrote: "They operate under the idea of getting rid of the overpopulation problem as their number one concern."
What a great point.
And due to the huge pro-spay/neuter campaign that is pushed by humane society, county and state animal control, and even all other kids of dog organizations (like the AKC) it has become an accepted myth that fixing your dog doesn't do anything to the dog, but make them sterile.
Which is total F-ing Bullshyte.
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Re: Spaying the Female
[Re: Jim Janusek ]
#11305 - 01/20/2004 01:41 PM |
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Thanks for the replies.
My vet is one of those who pushes to spay/neuter right@ six months. Heat cycles don't really bother me much and two or three is tolerable at least.
This is my DREAM dog and I really don't want to mess up with her.
Thanks Again <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />
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Re: Spaying the Female
[Re: Jim Janusek ]
#11306 - 01/20/2004 02:12 PM |
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I've been reading in various places (AVMA too I think) that spaying may increase aggression in females due to the lowered estrogen. Anyone know if this is true? If so, if you have a bossy, aggressive female, would it be best not to spay????
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Re: Spaying the Female
[Re: Jim Janusek ]
#11307 - 01/20/2004 02:39 PM |
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Both my females were spayed at 6 months. Both of them are the same size, or smaller than littermates that were spayed later. They also have the same proportions as the females in their litter. Neither has mammary cancer or problems with their bones (one is only 5 but the other is 10).
I think the overweight thing, frankly is a crock. I know if I over feed, and under exercise either of them, they will gain weight. But as a responsible pet owner, I am up to that challenge and both of my dogs are fit and hale.
Neither of my dogs have ever started a dog fight, and the only ones they have been indirectly involved in, they have been trying to get to me to have me deal with the problem dogs. They are both registered therapy dogs. Both go to dog trials all the time. Are around other dogs and people so I also feel the spaying early = aggression is an Old Wives Tale.
I also know I never had any furniture/carpets ruined when they went in season. I never had to miss any agility trial or therapy dog sessions because they were in heat. I never had to worry about them running loose (not that I am looking for that to happen) and maybe coming back after finding a male. Never had to worry about an unwanted or unexpected pregnancy. And I knew, absolutely, completely, and for sure, that I was not going to be contributing to the hundreds (thousands?) of purebred and mixed GSD's that are killed every year due to lack of finding enough good homes.
So I will aways choose to spay my dogs UNLESS I am planning to breed them. And that would only happen if I knew all about breeding, breeding GSD's, genetic traits, how they are passes on, went to enough show/trials to know my dogs had 'the right stuff', and knew enough to IMPROVE the breed. Just adding more adorable GSD's to a world full of adorable GSD's would not be a goal I would want.
So I spay my girls at 6 months, and they are both just fine, normal, and the light of my eye.
Intelligent dogs rarely want to please people whom they do not respect --- W.R. Koehler |
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Re: Spaying the Female
[Re: Jim Janusek ]
#11308 - 01/20/2004 03:37 PM |
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Re: Spaying the Female
[Re: Jim Janusek ]
#11309 - 01/20/2004 04:09 PM |
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The problem is that there are many people in America who don't take any serious steps to prevent their dogs from having accidental litters, and they have throw away mentality about their dogs when their welcome wears off.
I'll agree with that, and if an early spay helps make the responsibility that much easier for we Americans who are (apparently) less able to keep our dogs seperated, I say it's spay all the way!
And I'm thinking if I need to look at the stats for a huge population of dogs to see the differences in size/growth, than the difference (though I admit it may exist) is not worth the wait.
Along with the fact, how surprised am I that with the USA having the fattest people in the world it is beyond us to even regulate what our dogs eat. It is a simple formula, less food and more exercise makes a fit dog. I see plenty of fat intact dogs for the same reason I see fat spayed/neutered dogs. They are fed too much, and not exercised enough. So maybe a neutered/spayed dog may 'tend' to gain more weight? They can all get fat.
Sorry to be on the spay/neuter rampaige. Just spent way too much time on petfinder.com looking at dogs that will be dead in the next week or so cause there aren't enough homes in this country. Want a nice PUREBRED 11 week old GSD and live on the east coast ? http://www.petfinder.com/pet.cgi?action=...w=1&row=0&tmpl=
Intelligent dogs rarely want to please people whom they do not respect --- W.R. Koehler |
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Re: Spaying the Female
[Re: Jim Janusek ]
#11310 - 01/20/2004 05:08 PM |
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Originally posted by Jenn Kavanaugh:
The problem is that there are many people in America who don't take any serious steps to prevent their dogs from having accidental litters, and they have throw away mentality about their dogs when their welcome wears off.
I'll agree with that, and if an early spay helps make the responsibility that much easier for we Americans who are (apparently) less able to keep our dogs seperated, I say it's spay all the way! It's not "we Americans" who are irresponsible. It's a subset of Americans... the ones who get their pets from BYBs and pet shops, often as an impulse purchase. The readers of this forum are generally not among the irresponsible subset, nor are the folks on similar forums and email lists. You're preaching to the wrong people. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />
Along with the fact, how surprised am I that with the USA having the fattest people in the world it is beyond us to even regulate what our dogs eat. It is a simple formula, less food and more exercise makes a fit dog. I see plenty of fat intact dogs for the same reason I see fat spayed/neutered dogs. They are fed too much, and not exercised enough. So maybe a neutered/spayed dog may 'tend' to gain more weight? They can all get fat.
I agree that it is usually true that if dog owners would just stop overfeeding Fido he wouldn't be fat. But it's not always a matter of just feeding them less. If a dog develops hypothyroidism, it can be difficult to control their weight. Hypothyroidism is significantly more common in spay/neutered dogs.
Laura Sanborn
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