John Eiszler wrote 11/27/2007 06:46 PM Skinny BARF Fed Puppy #165162 - 11/27/2007 06:46 PM
John Eiszler Webboard User Reg: 11-10-2007 Posts: 9 Loc: Offline	I have an 11 week old female GSD pup that I have on BRF diet. I'm feeding mostly chicken backs (extra skin cut off) with some ground turkey and some chicken hearts and gizzards. I'm using Salmon Oil, Cod Liver Oil, Super C and SynFlex Joint Formula as supplements. All behavior and development seems normal, but I am a bit concerned with slow weight gain. the pup is about 17 pounds and has only been gaining about a pound a week since i got her at 8 weeks. This is quite a bit below some of the growth charts I've seen. I'm feeding three times a day about 1/2 of a back each time. I've offered more, but this is usually as much as she eats. Should I be concerned or doing something that i'm not? Thanks in advance for your comments! John
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Connie Sutherland wrote 11/27/2007 07:11 PM Re: Skinny BARF Fed Puppy [Re: John Eiszler ] #165165 - 11/27/2007 07:11 PM
Connie Sutherland Moderator Reg: 07-13-2005 Posts: 31571 Loc: North-Central coast of California Offline	How does she look, and what does the vet say about her weight? I'm sure some puppy experts here will have advice, too. Aside from weight, do you know that when you give fish oil (a very good thing), you must also give Vitamin E? And I'd be thinking about some protein-source variety. Some of that ground turkey could be replaced sometimes with non-poultry meats or fish, and you could use yogurt too (no sugar, live cultures, plain).
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Terra Presotto wrote 11/27/2007 07:49 PM Re: Skinny BARF Fed Puppy [Re: Connie Sutherland ] #165178 - 11/27/2007 07:49 PM
Terra Presotto Webboard User Reg: 10-18-2007 Posts: 147 Loc: Toronto,Canada Offline	Are these growth charts based on raw fed puppies or kibble fed? I read that raw fed pups don't have the growth spurts kibble fed pups do, and develop more slow and steady.
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Debbie Bruce wrote 11/27/2007 08:09 PM Re: Skinny BARF Fed Puppy [Re: Terra Presotto ] #165182 - 11/27/2007 08:09 PM
Debbie Bruce Webboard User Reg: 08-23-2007 Posts: 1196 Loc: Centralia, Missouri Offline	Raw fed puppies do grow much more slowly than kibble fed puppies. Since I switched all my pups to raw I'm not seeing the tremendous growth spurt from 8-12 weeks of age that I saw before, they would almost double their weight in that time frame on kibble. They all look great on the raw and are growing at a nice steady rate. As long as your pup is in good condition I wouldn't worry.
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John Eiszler wrote 11/27/2007 08:19 PM Re: Skinny BARF Fed Puppy [Re: Terra Presotto ] #165184 - 11/27/2007 08:19 PM
John Eiszler Webboard User Reg: 11-10-2007 Posts: 9 Loc: Offline	She looks fine! This pic is at 10 weeks. I can feel ribs and most of the skeleton. It's the rate of weight gain that seems very slow to me. Of course, this is my first GSD, I had bully breeds before which are muscular even when young. We have a Vet Appt this week and will certainly bring it up then. I do need to add Vit E. What amounts and form? Is there a powder like Super C? I've tried giving vegetable pulp and yogurt too, with very little interest expressed i.e. a couple of licks. I'll mix up the chicken with some beef and some tripe if I can get it.
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Connie Sutherland wrote 11/27/2007 09:08 PM Re: Skinny BARF Fed Puppy [Re: John Eiszler ] #165190 - 11/27/2007 09:08 PM
Connie Sutherland Moderator Reg: 07-13-2005 Posts: 31571 Loc: North-Central coast of California Offline	Slow and steady is MUCH better for the dog's hips and all joints. 100 IU or 200 IU for that size dog will be good. You can get it in gelcaps in any health or drug store.... and dogs generally eat them eagerly. I used to pierce and squeeze, until I realized that they view them as lil doggy caviar. Vitamin E is usually sold as alpha-tocopheryl acetate. The synthetic form is labeled "D, L" while the natural form is labeled "D". Mixed natural tocopherols is an even better choice.
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John Eiszler wrote 12/04/2007 10:28 PM Re: Skinny BARF Fed Puppy [Re: Connie Sutherland ] #166765 - 12/04/2007 10:28 PM
John Eiszler Webboard User Reg: 11-10-2007 Posts: 9 Loc: Offline	My Vet was not concerned with the weight or weight gain. I got the usual "You can't feed chicken bones - splinters, salmonella, etc." from the the Vet Tech, as well as trying to be sold a 'maintenance plan' that included a vaccine against dental decay. All this while saying how good the pup looked! I passed! I think the tide is turning and eventually Vets will have no choice but to recommend a raw diet. Of course, I still got a puppy welcome bag with some Science Diet in it!
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Carol Boche wrote 12/04/2007 10:33 PM Re: Skinny BARF Fed Puppy [Re: John Eiszler ] #166766 - 12/04/2007 10:33 PM
Carol Boche Webboard User Reg: 10-30-2005 Posts: 4531 Loc: South Dakota, USA Offline	Quote: John Eiszler I think the tide is turning and eventually Vets will have no choice but to recommend a raw diet. I totally agree, and the sooner the better.....then you would get a chicken back in the little goodie bag..... Until The Tale of the Lioness is told, the Story will Always Glorfy the Hunter
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Lynne Barrows wrote 12/05/2007 10:31 AM Re: Skinny BARF Fed Puppy [Re: Connie Sutherland ] #166812 - 12/05/2007 10:31 AM
Lynne Barrows Webboard User Reg: 09-22-2007 Posts: 2531 Loc: S. Florida Offline	Quote: Connie Sutherland Aside from weight, do you know that when you give fish oil (a very good thing), you must also give Vitamin E? Why do you have to give both together?? I am getting ready to take the plunge to raw, and want to have as much info about raw nutrition as possible...
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Connie Sutherland wrote 12/05/2007 11:09 AM Re: Skinny BARF Fed Puppy [Re: Lynne Barrows ] #166826 - 12/05/2007 11:09 AM
Connie Sutherland Moderator Reg: 07-13-2005 Posts: 31571 Loc: North-Central coast of California Offline	The system uses Vitamin E in processing the fish oil (or any oil supplement). The E protects the delicate PUFAs, and the processing of them will use E that's available (this is for people too), so you want to replenish it.
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