I think you'll find that the crazy thing about ecollars are that people have a strong opinions about them that have never used them.

"The trainer disagrees and says there really is no reason for it, it's just another gimmick and sometimes a substitute for the time it takes to train the dog properly - ie: the quick fix. "

I wouldn't learn ecollar use from this trainer, lol. Considering the ecollar a "gimmick" is goofy. How else would you correct a dog off leash?

 Quote: al curbow

I think you'll find that the crazy thing about ecollars are that people have a strong opinions about them that have never used them.

"The trainer disagrees and says there really is no reason for it, it's just another gimmick and sometimes a substitute for the time it takes to train the dog properly - ie: the quick fix. "

I wouldn't learn ecollar use from this trainer, lol. Considering the ecollar a "gimmick" is goofy. How else would you correct a dog off leash?

"I wouldn't learn ecollar use from this trainer." Good point.

"How else would you correct a dog off leash?"

this trend is all just wrong - quick, clean, convenience, and think your better than someone who bashes a dog with a pipe, yr not.

the only ones who can justify such tools are LEO and SWAT - no sport/pet training is justified IMO.

u should just give up n leave your dogs alone.

Hi Al
An e-collar can be an excellent tool.
I haven't used one yet but I'm looking into to get one down the road.
Ed and Cindy are using them from what I read.
It is used in all kind of dog sports and by pet owners.
The trainer lacks of knowledge.

Really?

My own perception is that a DVD like this one http://leerburg.com/318.htm that teaches the correct use IS better than "someone who bashes a dog with a pipe."

http://leerburg.com/318.htm

QUOTE: Until now there has never been a training DVD that makes sense which teaches pet owners the concepts of remote collar training. The electric collar DVDs that manufacturer ship with their remote collars videos are useless. These manufacturers DVDs are based on old school training techniques that use "escape training methods."

When used properly, remote collars are one of the most humane training tools available to dog trainers. I call it training with an invisible leash.

There is a myth that stimulation from an electric collar always involves pain. This is simply not true. We will show how to train using very very low levels of stimulation (using the nick button) found on almost all remote collars. I compare these levels of stimulation to lightly patting your dog on the shoulder with your hand. These levels are so low that the average person may not even feel if the collar was placed on their arm. END partial quote

The pipe-bashing comment is uninformed, Peter. So uninformed that it's odd to make a strong comment like that one based on such lack of information.

How would you "bash with a pipe" to would equate to the very low-stim level taught in the DVD?

 Quote: peter cavallaro

"How else would you correct a dog off leash?"

this trend is all just wrong - quick, clean, convenience, and think your better than someone who bashes a dog with a pipe, yr not.

the only ones who can justify such tools are LEO and SWAT - no sport/pet training is justified IMO.

u should just give up n leave your dogs alone.

Thought about ignoring this but just can't.

Peter, no offense intended, but your ignorance on the proper use of an ecollar is showing. Let me stress I ALWAYS recommend marker training and positive reinforcement as THE way to train a dog. Always.

The ecollar can be an excellent tool in the hands of a responsible trainer to maintain control over a dog off leash. This does NOT mean you are shocking him non-stop; I've seen Dennis Jones recall his uberhund just with the vibrate mode. It allows to "tap" or "nudge" the dog without being physically attached.

If using an ecollar on my dog when outside prevents him from doing a stupid thing and chasing a cat or deer into the woods - that is a good thing. IF I have to give him a hard correction one time to keep that dog alive, I'll do it.

I'll try to get a vid of how afraid Falcon is when we go to put his collar on as well... tail wagging, wiggling all around knowing he gets to go outside and run off line. Horrid, horrid sight.

He acts totally different when I beat him with the pipe, so I won't show that on video.

I've never seen one used correctly. Most people have terrible timing and correct the dog much too harshly and far too late for the dog to make the proper connection.

I live in an apartment complex where e-collars are common. People take their untrained dogs out to the fenced-in "dog park" provided here, stand around talking on cell phones and hitting their e-collar remotes when their dogs come in contact with other dogs. It's brutal and horrifying.

I am not opposed to their use---used as Anne and Barbara and others have described they have their place. I just doubt that more than a tiny fraction of dog owners understand how, when, and why to choose this tool.

Edited by Meredith Hamilton (02/28/2011 08:07 PM)
Edit reason: eta

 Quote: Roland Kaschuba

Hi Al
An e-collar can be an excellent tool.
I haven't used one yet but I'm looking into to get one down the road.
Ed and Cindy are using them from what I read.
It is used in all kind of dog sports and by pet owners.
The trainer lacks of knowledge.

Roland, I don't know if you meant to address Al or Peter, but if you meant Al, you may want to re-read his post.

 Quote: meredith hamilton

I've never seen one used correctly. Most people have terrible timing and correct the dog much too harshly and far too late for the dog to make the proper connection.

I live in an apartment complex where e-collars are common. People take their untrained dogs out to the fenced-in "dog park" provided here, stand around talking on cell phones and hitting their e-collar remotes when their dogs come in contact with other dogs. It's brutal and horrifying.

I've seen this too. It IS brutal and horrifying.

But it has nothing at all in common with its use as described and explained by Ed.

 Quote: Meredith Hamilton

stand around talking on cell phones and hitting their e-collar remotes when their dogs come in contact with other dogs. It's brutal and horrifying.

In my opinion, those folks should be prosecuted for animal cruelty. To take a dog into a dog park and the shock/correct it for coming in contact with other dogs?????